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Bro pages: like man pages, but with examples only

bropages.org

241–250 of 872 posts

Re: Bro pages: like man pages, but with examples only

#241
post #205
post #200

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not feeling oppressed. The problem isn't me feeling oppressed, it's other people feeling oppressed. Poor choice of language can set up an exclusionary environment. To you, this may be funny. To me, your accusation of humorlessness reminds me of people who engage in sexually harassing "jokes" in the workplace, and then try to get away with it by using "humor" as an excuse. You aren't the one who gets to decide whe…

Your attitude and remarks are creating a hostile and uncomfortable environment for me. I demand that you stop immediately.

From the Wikipedia link in your profile I see you invented Google's "Don't Be Evil' motto.

At least now I finally understand how they manage to still hold on to that.

As long as you redefine evil to exclude things you don't feel other people should be hurt by you're all clear!

Re: Bro pages: like man pages, but with examples only

#242
post #99

Great idea; shame about the name. Here's the problem with using words like "bro" (however jokingly): the problem is not with what you [0] are thinking when you read the word "bro", but with what other people , especially newcomers, are thinking. The locker-room atmosphere that stuff like this creates is a huge barrier to entry for a lot of people, women especially, who infer that on top of all the technically difficu…

Interesting point, just want to point out that changing the name is as simple as sudo echo "bro $*" > /usr/bin/explain

No it's not. sudo echo "bro $*" > http://bropages.org doesn't work and "gem install explain" neither.

Re: Bro pages: like man pages, but with examples only

#243
post #200
post #155

Awesome idea. Shame about the humorless nature of this community. To me, a "bro" is a dumb, fratboy version of a man, which makes the name hilariously perfect. If you're feeling oppressed and excluded by a command name, your real problems lie elsewhere.

I'm not feeling oppressed. The problem isn't me feeling oppressed, it's other people feeling oppressed. Poor choice of language can set up an exclusionary environment. To you, this may be funny. To me, your accusation of humorlessness reminds me of people who engage in sexually harassing "jokes" in the workplace, and then try to get away with it by using "humor" as an excuse. You aren't the one who gets to decide whe…

We should compile in a Wiki (or something similar) everything that might make someone uncomfortable.

That way, we can look up and make sure this thing never happens. Then, with any luck, a strawperson (not strawman) will never feel like that for something on the internet again.

Re: Bro pages: like man pages, but with examples only

#244
post #99

Great idea; shame about the name. Here's the problem with using words like "bro" (however jokingly): the problem is not with what you [0] are thinking when you read the word "bro", but with what other people , especially newcomers, are thinking. The locker-room atmosphere that stuff like this creates is a huge barrier to entry for a lot of people, women especially, who infer that on top of all the technically difficu…

I disagree. There is nothing wrong with 'bro' just like there is nothing wrong with a programming language 'Julia'. They are both gender specific and you as an individual can infer whatever you like about the term. Only you, the individual, can determine how you feel about what someone says or writes, only you can determine whether or not you're insulted. How something IS vs. how a group FEELS are separate, and one s…

Unless you're trying to market a new product, in which case how people feel really does determine how your product is.

Re: Bro pages: like man pages, but with examples only

#245
post #174
post #99

Great idea; shame about the name. Here's the problem with using words like "bro" (however jokingly): the problem is not with what you [0] are thinking when you read the word "bro", but with what other people , especially newcomers, are thinking. The locker-room atmosphere that stuff like this creates is a huge barrier to entry for a lot of people, women especially, who infer that on top of all the technically difficu…

As a society, we need to get over the chivalrous notion that something is automatically bad if it might trigger negative emotions in women. If women tend to be intimidated by head-to-head competition (of any type) with a man, it doesn't mean it's wrong or immoral for a man to compete head-to-head with a woman. If women tend to be intimidated when a muscular male stranger is in their presence, it doesn't mean it's wro…

Eh, I dunno. I'm definitely not one of those people whose champion cause is gender issues, and to be totally honest I rarely even think about it much. My general philosophy is "be professional", not "lol check ur privilege." That being said, I think you're off here.

> If women tend to be intimidated by head-to-head competition (of any type) with a man, it doesn't mean it's wrong or immoral for a man to compete head-to-head with a woman.

Err, it sure is when men have an obvious advantage. This is why we don't allow men to play in the WNBA. When men don't have an obvious advantage (e.g. competing for grades in class), you're absolutely right. Men definitely have an advantage in tech right now. You can argue whether that's innate or cultural, but it's kinda hard to argue the premise.

> If women tend to be intimidated when a muscular male stranger is in their presence, it doesn't mean it's wrong or immoral to be a muscular man in the presence of a woman.

Your actions are immoral, your mere existence never is. It's about empathy. No one's ever going to say you're wrong for being a muscular man, but people will think you're either insensitive or super oblivious if you're a huge guy wearing a hoodie walking 6 inches behind a small 105 pound woman at night in an alley.

> Likewise, if women tend to be intimidated when men use language that expresses pride in their manhood, it doesn't mean it's wrong for boys or men to use language that expresses pride in their manhood.

Come on: first of all replace "man/men" with "white" and see why your statement sounds a little ridiculous.

Second of all, no one wants to hear that shit either way. If I have to listen to a group of women talk about how great it is to be a woman, I'm similarly going to either leave the conversation or say "what the fuck?". Wouldn't you?

That shit gets old real fast if you're on the outer circle.

> To all the boys and young men who are barraged daily with messages scolding them (or worse) for using language that implies they're male: Keep your chin up. These people want to break you down, not lift anyone else up.

Truthfully, nobody really gives a shit what anyone has to say. It's more about who you say it around. If you wanna jibber-jabber about 401Ks or real estate investment with your bros, then go nuts. Maybe keep that talk to a minimum when you're around the guy making $8.50 an hour though, you know?

It's just about sensitivity. Bro.

Re: Bro pages: like man pages, but with examples only

#246

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Absolutely, lets throw away our sense of humor and wordplay because there are theoretically people that might be offended (maybe, kindof. You know. In theory.). (N.B. the people that seem to be offended so far are offended on other peoples behalf..) Isn't it way more offensive to assume that women are such dainty delicate creatures that like, they won't get the joke?

http://geekfeminism.wikia.com/wiki/Not_a_woman http://geekfeminism.wikia.com/wiki/You%27re_the_sexist#.22Ta...

Someone should coin an analogue to Godwin, where linking to the Geek Feminism Wiki is seen as an instant loss of credibility.

The wiki is hugely anecdotal beyond all reason, poorly written, often incoherent and their editorial guidelines clearly show that they have virtually no standard as long as the content fits under a vaguely feminist or social justice-oriented perspective.

(http://geekfeminism.wikia.com/wiki/Meta:Editorial_guidelines)

Their "vision of intersectional feminism" is postmodernism gone wrong.

Re: Bro pages: like man pages, but with examples only

#247
post #164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We're so used to the "man" command that I think it's hard to judge how it would sound if someone invented it today. There might very well be calls to rename it. We're okay with it because we're used to it, it's from a different time, and it's far too late to change it now. Those aren't good excuses for a new project.

The 'man' command is named that because its short for 'manual', it has nothing to do with 'men'. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manual_pages

The etymology is inoffensive, but the term itself is still exclusionary by way of "man" also being a gendered term. We are (and should be) more cognisant of these issues these days.

Re: Bro pages: like man pages, but with examples only

#248
post #198
post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Except that your argument has the same flaws has res0nat0r's argument: neither of you know what the author was thinking when he named it. Was the creator thinking of brogramming? Was the creator thinking of it being the "bro"ther of the man pages? None of us know, so it is useless to argue about it.

>Was the creator thinking of brogramming? Was the creator thinking of it being the "bro"ther of the man pages? What does intent matter? If the discussion on a tool is overtaken by the discussion on the gender trolling in the name, then feedback that the name is off putting to a portion of the potential audience is valid. If I was marketing a product in a foreign language, I would be open to feedback that the name has…

[deleted]

Re: Bro pages: like man pages, but with examples only

#249
post #99

Great idea; shame about the name. Here's the problem with using words like "bro" (however jokingly): the problem is not with what you [0] are thinking when you read the word "bro", but with what other people , especially newcomers, are thinking. The locker-room atmosphere that stuff like this creates is a huge barrier to entry for a lot of people, women especially, who infer that on top of all the technically difficu…

Much as I dislike the word 'bro' (and jock and nerd ftm), there are two huge assumptions here - 1. the language we use has that kind of subliminal power, and 2. that unintended offence is something given rather than taken.

Stephen Fry has views on both topics: http://www.atheistrepublic.com/gallery/stephen-fry-taking-of... http://www.theguardian.com/uk/2005/jun/05/religion.hayfestiv...

Re: Bro pages: like man pages, but with examples only

#250

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fsck is funnier to a much wider group of people. The whole bro humour is deliberately exclusionary, it is an in-joke for tying together small groups of (mostly) young males. That is what it is for. This is also why it can work well in small groups, because in-jokes can help tie them together. However, as evidenced by this thread, a lot of people, many with well developed senses of humour, just don't find the whole br…

The whole bro humour is deliberately exclusionary, it is an in-joke for tying together small groups of (mostly) young males. That is what it is for. It's important to draw the distinction between the usage of the term to (1) describe oneself and one's peers and create an ingroup as opposed to (2) describe (and often criticize) others I don't see a lot of unironic usage of (1), aside from the odd tone-deaf fratboy. I…

(1) is exactly the context of bropages though, which is the topic of this thread, so it definitely exists.
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