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Why some US restaurants are banning tips

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Re: Why some US restaurants are banning tips

#241

Post by ButlerianJihad »

elyobo wrote: post #50
getfacl wrote: post #31

The biggest barrier to ending tipping in the USA is that restaurants are almost always over staffed there. The owner wants the maximum ratio of servers to customers possible. In the typical USA system, being paid primarily in tips means the server is highly incentivized to upsell the customer as much as possible and do everything they can to increase the total bill, and therefor increase their tip. Essentially a comm…

Is that why US service ("checking on the customer every few minutes") is so incredibly annoying...

It seems like the universal standard in my area is that the server plunks down my food dishes and immediately asks if I would like anything else with that. And I don't know about neurotypical patrons, but in my mind it is impossible for me to process whether I will need anything else while the server is standing right there, staring at me and waiting for me to answer. So invariably I am forced to say "no" and then, more often than not, I belatedly discover what it is that my meal also needed, and so I wait to flag them down again (this necessarily involves not picking up utensils and not eating anything, so that they notice there is something amiss.)

I really haven't been smothered by checkups every few minutes. When the servers are really good, they can anticipate when you need something by simply looking at you and your table. They know when your drink is empty and when you want it filled. A server should rarely need to ask that stuff verbally. If they are continually checking up, they are inexperienced or insecure.

After I make my order, the server will usually try and take my menu. Lately I've said "I'd like to hold on to this" and they love when you do that! I don't always follow-up with another order, but sometimes I just need an extra side dish, or a dessert.

I've had that overstaffed experience, too. There are one or two small chains around here that employ 3x as many servers as they need. And their rooms are always 1/5th full or less. So the moment I walk in, there are 3-4 people greeting me and escorting me to a table, before I can even pull off my hat and gloves. In the same place, while they don't appear to do "team service" I would meet one waitress, and then get fobbed off on another guy for no stated reason. If they are sharing tips, a lot of slices to that pie.

Re: Why some US restaurants are banning tips

#242

Post by pjc50 »

cge wrote: post #188
tdeck wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We're going in the other direction. In Seattle it's common for restaurants to tack on an extra "service charge" that's not a tip, just because. It's supposed to be declared somewhere. With tip your bill can easily end up 40% higher.

That’s also very common in the UK, and shows up elsewhere in Europe sometimes. In the UK, they are legally but not practically or socially discretionary. There are some tax advantages for the restaurant and in the ideal case for staff.

IME they mostly only appear for large tables in the UK.

Re: Why some US restaurants are banning tips

#243

Post by irishcoffee »

Fargren wrote: post #203
yostrovs wrote: post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The waiter comes by about twice in a visit, asks you "Is there anything you need?". You say "No thanks". And you get upset by that. And then you complain about Americans and their terrible ways. What sense does that make? Can't you see how rude you are? The person simply came by to check, since that person is your waiter and the goal is that you have a tasty and pleasant time.

If I need anything, I will call for the waiter. I do find it intrusive and patronizing if they come and check if I need anything. I'm not "upset" about it, but it does make my dining experience worse. It also gives me the impression they are trying to get me to free up the table as soon as possible.

It is very amusing to me that in a different part of this thread people are complaining that the waiter doesn't come by enough, and here the complaint is the opposite.

Re: Why some US restaurants are banning tips

#244

Post by pirates »

paavope wrote: post #168
Yizahi wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've been in hundreds of not fancy restaurants across Europe in my life, in many countries. The service speed in like 95% of all cases is at maximum or vary close to it. It's between 0 to 1-2 minutes to get menu, then 0 to 1-2 minute to flag a waiter and order, and that all delays possibly induced by the serving staff. The rest is just how long it takes to cook and is not relevant here. So maybe USA shaves off a few…

It’s possible that many of the Americans commenting here have gone to very different restaurants than locals have in mind, and are basing their experiences on a very different sample. Like touristy places with a patio on the main old town square of (insert European city here)

The dining experiences I’ve had in London vs Barcelona are very different, and both of them are represented in these comments as “European”.

Re: Why some US restaurants are banning tips

#245

Post by bluebarbet »

yostrovs wrote: post #163
crazybonkersai wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ah much generalisation. Europe is over 40 countries with vast differences in quality of service and restaurant culture. I have been to restaurants in many European countries and the only generalisation I can make is that tip culture does not exist in Europe.

My last trip I gave a $10 tip to a waiter in a Spanish restaurant. I apologized that I didn't have euros. The guy smiled broadly and thanked me. If tip "culture" didn't exist in Europe, he would have thought of me as inappropriate and would have given the money back. Like if you try to give a tip to a firefighter, he'd give it back, because it's not appropriate.

He accepted it because he saw you as an American cash cow.

Obviously you will do as you please, but I wish tourists would try to get with the culture. As a European, one of many reasons I don't tip is that I don't want to encourage a class system where anyone who doesn't pay up is seen (and sees themselves) as stingy.

Re: Why some US restaurants are banning tips

#246

Post by ozlikethewizard »

yostrovs wrote: post #105
elyobo wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is that why US service ("checking on the customer every few minutes") is so incredibly annoying...

No. After you've ordered, it is rare to order anything else. You might ask for a refill of a beverage or something like ketchup, but the waiter is not expecting more ordering. It's simply expected by diners that their waiter is there and will help with whatever they need. In Europe you'll wait 20 minutes to get the attention of a waiter for salt or ketchup until your food is cold. Also in Europe this will be describe…

Ah yes the homogenous European culture. Can't say I've ever really experienced this anywhere other than when its obvious a restuarant is slammed. Spain is probably the worst place I've been for service but the standard is still generally very high, you just need to actually get someones attention they're not going to ask if you're ok all the time. Maybe this is a reflection of the standrd of the places you go or how you treat people?

Re: Why some US restaurants are banning tips

#247

Post by pjc50 »

sudo-i wrote: post #24
daef wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

welcome to europe, where tips are optional and sales tax is denoted

Unless it's a bottle deposit tax, then it gets added outside the advertised price ;) 2 Euro bottle of Coke, great, I have 2 euro left, pay 2 euro 20 please... Fawwwwwkkkkkkkkk

Green washing variant of that: deposit for reusable plastic cups. You can reclaim it but they're banking on you not bothering.

Edinburgh Fringe special variant: charging extra for plastic cups and then not accepting returns.

Re: Why some US restaurants are banning tips

#248

Post by manarth »

GJim wrote: post #239
manarth wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've seen this (UK), albeit "round up to £x.00 and donate the change to charity", which will use to announce "We've donated £X million to charity".

Ah, the charity donations. Esso petrol stations routinely ask for this, and the staff member ALWAYS clicks the 'no' button before you can offer your card. Source: Somebody who drives around the UK a lot for work.

B&Q are on the naughty list too (and the cashier also frequently clicks the 'no' button).

Re: Why some US restaurants are banning tips

#249

Post by analog31 »

vorticalbox wrote: post #94

> The people breaking their backs and minds in the kitchen - often the least visible and the least celebrated - were taking home a fraction of what the front staff made on tips for the same hours Why not put all tips into a pool and just share it out between everyone?

Both of my kids are tipped workers in the US. The places where they work do this exactly.

One place is a very popular restaurant with counter service. The other is a bar.

I also earn tips playing music on the side.

Re: Why some US restaurants are banning tips

#250

Post by alecbz »

bjourne wrote: post #126
getfacl wrote: post #31

The biggest barrier to ending tipping in the USA is that restaurants are almost always over staffed there. The owner wants the maximum ratio of servers to customers possible. In the typical USA system, being paid primarily in tips means the server is highly incentivized to upsell the customer as much as possible and do everything they can to increase the total bill, and therefor increase their tip. Essentially a comm…

Also, many Europeans have the "equal work, equal pay" mantra drilled into them. Tip-based salaries are the complete anti-thesis to that. It is obvious that better-looking younger women get more tips than those without those characteristics. It rubs me and many others the wrong way; hence, I never tip because that is always fair. As a customer I 100% prefer "worse" service over having to deal with the tipping BS. Amer…

At restaurants at least, most people I know just default tip 20% and only adjust up or down in pretty rare circumstances. Maybe it’s different in other parts of the US or for other generations, but I recall studies supporting that people generally have a set percent they always tip.
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