The Kimi K3 Moment

Post by idiotsecant » Sat, Jul 18, 2026, 10:08 PM UTC

nickysielicki wrote: post #57

jstummbillig wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Distillation “attacks” are not attacks. If "distillation attacks" happen, we have to conclude there is some value add in what model labs do. Regardless of how we feel about using existing human knowledge in the way they currently do, it's simply impractical to infer that everything that happens downstream of LLMs can not be an attack on some IP because of it. So both things can be true: a) People infringe on Anthro…

Regardless of whether it’s intellectual property or it isn’t intellectual property, it doesn’t actually matter. If AI doesn’t stop seeing diminishing returns in scaling up, and it hasn’t yet in the 10 years since the attention/transformers paper, the advent of AI will be the most important development in the history of humanity. Controlling that machine, or at least having one of your own, is an existential problem f…

Post by idiotsecant » Sat, Jul 18, 2026, 10:10 PM UTC

milkshakes wrote: post #189

InsideOutSanta wrote: post #157

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> empirically, it appears that distillation of a more advanced model is a required first step I see no evidence for that. > if this were not the case, then we would be observing chinese models that far surpass frontier models It's pretty clear that the primary reason for the difference is budget and compute availability. Chinese labs have at least an order of magnitude less money than Anthropic and OpenAI. > what hap…

https://www.anthropic.com/news/detecting-and-preventing-dist... Moonshot AI Scale: Over 3.4 million exchanges The operation targeted: Agentic reasoning and tool use Coding and data analysis Computer-use agent development Computer vision Moonshot (Kimi models) employed hundreds of fraudulent accounts spanning multiple access pathways. Varied account types made the campaign harder to detect as a coordinated operation.…

Post by SwellJoe » Sat, Jul 18, 2026, 10:11 PM UTC

osti wrote: post #118

SwellJoe wrote: post #8

I tried Kimi K3 on a task I've done with every other model I use regularly ( https://swelljoe.com/post/i-let-every-agent-implement-its-ow... ) and found it chewed a lot longer on the problem and ate up almost the entirety of a 5 hour usage limit on their $19 plan. I only have the $20 plan from OpenAI and the same task, with a lot of the same implementation details as Kimi Code, only took a few minutes and consumed al…

Absolutely do not pay for the kimi plans thinking they will be cheaper. If you sign up with a Chinese phone number, you can get the same plan for 200 yuan instead of 200 usd, it also only accepts Chinese payment methods iirc. So the plans are really made for Chinese userbase.

Post by steve-atx-7600 » Sat, Jul 18, 2026, 10:16 PM UTC

ekidd wrote: post #206

dehrmann wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Subscription usage limits are hard to measure as none of the providers tell you directly what it means in terms of tokens or anything else you can easily compare AI subscription pricing is so goofy. You get some amount of usage that varies by models, is measured by opaque token usage, driven by how many tokens the (usually) vendor-provided interface (or model itself) wants to use. Then your usage is limited by time…

AI subscription pricing was fine when it was $100/month for some opaque 5 hour token budget I don't think I ever used, not even that one day where I coded for 14 hours non-stop using Fable. But like most people with low token usage, I had a human in the loop and and I didn't use workflows with swarms of agents. Now, of course, the plan is to remove Fable from the subscription. To paraphrase Darth Vader, they have alt…

Post by georgemcbay » Sat, Jul 18, 2026, 10:19 PM UTC

nonethewiser wrote: post #231

NitpickLawyer wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> People infringe on Anthropics IP Unless someone literally stole the weights somehow (which is not out of the question, I doubt either oAI/Anthropic have the capabilities to prevent a state-level actor getting those weights), distillation from generations is not infringement on anyone's IP nor is it stealing nor is it an attack. It can't be. As long as you pay for tokens you get to do whatever you want with them. So…

Its definitely an attack. Thats established from anthropics perspective. No one has a right to use Anthropic’s services in ways that directly violate the ToS and user agreements.