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Removing the modem and GPS from my 2024 RAV4 hybrid

arkadiyt.com

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Re: Removing the modem and GPS from my 2024 RAV4 hybrid

#241

Post by dylan604 »

giancarlostoro wrote: post #221
dylan604 wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've bought multiple Toyotas from the same dealer, and each time the sales person has been overly aggressive about setting up the app and connecting to the car. The first time I let them do it to a point as I had not seen what it did, but had to prevent them from syncing contacts. After that, I had to be very stern about not needing help to set up an app I was never going to use. I don't know if they are used to neop…

> I don't know if they are used to neophytes being unable to handle this and think they are doing a service or if it's a push to get people to connect/sync as much as possible. Likely doing it to remove any frustrations from the brand new buyer being unable to figure out how to set it all up. The last thing you need is someone changing their mind about the car they just bought, because well if setting up the app is a…

The main problem I had with it is the fact it requires an app in the first place. Once they have an app on your phone, they have access to so much data. The app by nature of the functions it performs will need GPS, Bluetooth, and Contacts at a minimum. Once they have that access, there's nothing stopping them from using it for whatever they want. That's just absolutely not something I'm willing to give a car app. Do we really think their map/routing app will be better than something else I could use instead? I don't even like using map apps because of their power to snoop and report.

Re: Removing the modem and GPS from my 2024 RAV4 hybrid

#242

Post by throwway120385 »

ezfe wrote: post #111
arkadiyt wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's from the linked rav4world post

> One caveat, if you use bluetooth to connect your phone to the car DCM will use your phone to connect to the mother ship and presumably send your data. I only use my iPhone cable to connect to the car which does not have this effect. A random post on a forum is not evidence that Toyota has found a magic way to exfiltrate data over a bluetooth connection without turning on hotspot/etc.

RNDIS was a mechanism for tethering over USB, and you could certainly pair "Bluetooth Network Adapters" for years and there's a profile for it. So there's at least precedent for it. That makes it pretty plausible to me.

Re: Removing the modem and GPS from my 2024 RAV4 hybrid

#244

Post by 866-RON-0-FEZ »

alentred wrote: post #172

Buy Nissan instead, they will do that for you free of charge. I own 2021 Nissan Leaf and Nissan sent me an email early this year telling that the communication infrastructure costs too much for them and they are taking it down. Jokes aside, I am seriously pissed at Nissan because it was one of reasons I bought it in the first place: to pre-heat or pre-cool the car remotely before going to work, while it is still plug…

> to pre-heat or pre-cool the car remotely before going to work, while it is still plugged to the wall charger

Modern aftermarket remote start systems work with both ICE and EVs alike. Take a look at Compustar. You can remote start your Leaf with a key fob from 1/2 mile away, no telemetry, connectivity, or silly app needed.

Re: Removing the modem and GPS from my 2024 RAV4 hybrid

#245

Post by djoldman »

oblio wrote: post #224
hollow-moe wrote: post #218

Can't do that in Fr*nce and likely other European countries, all vehicles must have eCall and your vechicle might not pass the mandatory routine check you need to do once in a while to be allowed on the road. Hope you like biking a lot.

> Fr*nce What's this?

France.

Re: Removing the modem and GPS from my 2024 RAV4 hybrid

#246

Post by djoldman »

hollow-moe wrote: post #218

Can't do that in Fr*nce and likely other European countries, all vehicles must have eCall and your vechicle might not pass the mandatory routine check you need to do once in a while to be allowed on the road. Hope you like biking a lot.

TIL:

> eCall was made mandatory in all new cars approved for manufacture within the European Union as of April 2018.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ECall

Re: Removing the modem and GPS from my 2024 RAV4 hybrid

#247

Post by KennyBlanken »

rkagerer wrote: post #130
nurple wrote: post #5

> Even after the modem is removed, if you connect your phone to the car via Bluetooth then the car will use your phone as an internet connection and send all the same telemetry data back to Toyota. However, if you use a wired USB connection then it does not do that (see the discussion here and elsewhere), so I exclusively use CarPlay via USB. The problem with this is that both carplay and android auto capture their o…

Is there any information about precisely what vehicle telemetry they capture and retain? I know the laws are far from perfect, but isn't there some legislation compelling them to disclose what they collect? What specifically would be the most relevant law/regulation? (If it varies by geography, pick any major market, eg. California, that is big enough to impact their engineering design and the content of published ma…

Generally speaking the author seems to wave a bunch of conspiracies around without the evidence to support it, or frankly, much technical knowledge.

The author seems unaware that in iOS you can uncheck nearly every single location usage the OS and Apple Apps themselves collect.

On iOS not only can you shut off things like traffic reporting while using Maps and cellular/WiFI/Bluetooth data collection...unlike Google, Apple will let you use those services without requiring you contribute to them.

Re: Removing the modem and GPS from my 2024 RAV4 hybrid

#248

Post by dotancohen »

ezfe wrote: post #176
stuckindoors wrote: post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When reading the article I think he appears to be talking about car play/android auto connection not audio only connections. I think Bluetooth in AA and Carplay is used to configure a local network between the phone and the car to transmit the images to the cars screen. I would assume that that data capability can also be used for the car to communicate with the Internet.

It does produce a local Wi-Fi network but there's no evidence that it supports internet communication. That would be considered a hotspot, which not all carriers even support.

How does the carrier know that the traffic is being proxied for another device, and not e.g. requested from the phone's web browser or another app?

Does the phone add a proxy header? Can it be configured to not add the header?

Re: Removing the modem and GPS from my 2024 RAV4 hybrid

#250

Post by willis936 »

fc417fc802 wrote: post #118
brewdad wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

GPS is receive only. If you've disabled the ability to send telemetry, there should be no reason to be concerned about the GPS antenna.

If it keeps collecting telemetry it could upload it later if it ever gets the chance. Better it isn't collected in the first place.

That also means it isn't passed to your phone via android auto / carplay. Phone GPS is much worse than car GPS for road navigation. It's basically unusable.
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