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You are not your job

jry.io

241–250 of 443 posts

Re: You are not your job

#241
More therapeutic nonsense for the AI age.[1]

[1] AI Inevitability Soothsaying https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=47362178

> Saying "I am a software engineer" is beginning to feel like saying "I am a calcultor" in 1950 now that digital machines can use electrical circuits to count, add, multiply - it's not long until they'll be able differentiate a non-continuous function... You're beginning to feel less-than-useful.

> This bothers a lot of people for a reason (I think) that has nothing to do with the technology. The fear isn't really about losing a job title, it's about losing the story you tell yourself about who you are.

Get Fing real. Most, most, most people in the world need a job to survive. Some technologists might have stonks and financial independence. Those with stocks or other kinds of passive (parasitic) income are the minority.

I think that goes for most programmers as well.

Okay so we’re going to get to how this just means you’ll need to change jobs. So let’s wait for that.

> I like Susan Fiske's research on how humans judge each other shows something worth sitting with. When you meet someone, you assess them on two dimensions. The first is warmth - do you believe they mean you well? The second is competence - do you believe they're capable?

This is farcical when you consider that people with enough capital can survive on just that, capital. No matter what the research says about “competence”. There are billions of dollars invested in portraying people with money as competent. But if that propaganda is ineffectual it’s not like it matters. The system is arranged such that they won’t be inconvenienced by the judgement of commoners.

> Thus far we have automated away "wasteful" or "unnecessary" jobs. Perhaps the elevator operator was your friend, someone you saw everyday. I'm not certain their purpose was "useless". They're gone nonetheless.

> This is the whole point of the system. [...]

The point of the system is to commoditize everything and concentrate wealth.

Labor is a commodity. Labor created automation. And labor will be discarded once the automation that it created displaces labor.

The automation is then fully in the hands of the so-called competent. Capital.

> Whether you do well through an economic transition or not has little to do with the cause (AI, digital technology, industrialization, coal), and more to do with the social and political structures which exist around you (which is a blog post for another day).

That’s rich. The author already told us the fairytale version of Capitalism, the version where we are supposedly all going to benefit. But now the author pretends to shy away and tell us that it is a blog post for another day?

No—you already took a stance with that statement, even with the premise of this therapeutic distraction since you assume that it is just a matter of changing jobs.

Is it though? When the whole system is made for Capital? And Capital obviously owns the automation? Who managed to buy up so much RAM that it caused a global shortage?

But meh, political structure and all that—trivialities for another day. We’re here to pump up Inevitability discourse with.

> You are not your job. You're a person first. Your ability to connect, be present, and make people feel understood is what makes you irreplaceable to the people around you, which is the only market that counts.

I’ll remember that while in the unemployment line.

Re: You are not your job

#242
> Whether you do well through an economic transition or not has little to do with the cause (AI, digital technology, industrialization, coal), and more to do with the social and political structures which exist around you (which is a blog post for another day).

I keep hearing "AI will free us to do things we love," and all I can think is, in what world? Because in this one, if you don't have labor worth buying or anyone to buy it, you don't eat.

Re: You are not your job

#243

Being able to see ourselves as something beyond our job (our means of survival) is a luxury. If a person can't provide for themselves the rest goes out the window fast. The only way to ease the anxiety in people isn't with fluff about their 'human worth', but rather to help them envision other tangible and plausible ways in which they can provide for themselves. The cold reality, in my opinion, is that the things we…

Throughout this diatribe I think you had multiple opportunities to see the value of human life. That you didn't, makes me think you actually don't value your own life and while that's entirely your right. But, to project onto others that they're "in denial" for valuing their own, their families', or complete strangers' lives isn't the radical ultra-rational flex you think it is.

To pick one mere point where you might have chosen to value life otherwise:

> They're not a rare thing like say, gold.

You mean the gold that's a relatively common chemical in the universe? You're comparing the elementary particle formed by astronomical processes to somethings which (even if metaphorically) exists only within organisms so complex we have yet to find signs of similar complexity in the universe.

What you say is cold, but hardly truth.

Re: You are not your job

#244

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> We are in fact very disposable and replaceable. To your friends and family as well? Or just your employer? You're describing things that may well be true for a lot of employers, but fall apart outside of that context.

For some rare once-in-a-lifetime friendships, you are not disposable, and if anything were to happen to you, you would be missed. I can count those on one hand. For most casual acquaintances (that some people incorrectly label as friends), it's certainly true. On the family's side: only parents, siblings, children, maybe some aunt or grandparent. Second distant cousin you saw 3 times in life?

[deleted]

Re: You are not your job

#245

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Only way UBI works is if the govts increase taxes on all income or any income to almost 90%+... And then re-distribute to each person accordingly. That ain't happening, no govt will be willing to try that, and rich won't let that happen, they will become slightly rich from very rich. that just ain't happening.

Have you heard about the last century? A few governments did that. You had to stand in line for food and your basic goods.

No they didn't. In the USSR, for example, not working without a valid reason was literally a crime (look up tuneyadstvo).

Re: You are not your job

#246

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For some rare once-in-a-lifetime friendships, you are not disposable, and if anything were to happen to you, you would be missed. I can count those on one hand. For most casual acquaintances (that some people incorrectly label as friends), it's certainly true. On the family's side: only parents, siblings, children, maybe some aunt or grandparent. Second distant cousin you saw 3 times in life?

Is that not enough?

It is (and even if it is not, it's just the way it is...).

what I'm arguing is that it's not only the workspace where we all are disposable and replaceable. It happens in friends and family context, too.

What to do with this information... I'm not sure. But usually it's a good first step to see things clearly.

Re: You are not your job

#247
post #227

Kind of bizarre how Fight Club was so influential a couple decades ago, but doesn’t seem to have much cultural impact today. This exact theme is one of the most memorable quotes from the movie. Too counter-cultural and anti-money for today’s young people, I think. Everyone’s trying to make it, not drop out of society.

Fight Club came out almost 30 years ago. Most young people have probably never heard of it. Also there's no such thing as "counterculture" in a world where culture isn't manufactured and controlled by some central authority. When there was only physical media and a few tv stations, "culture" was a fixed point one could obviously align with or against. Today in the post-internet non cultural milieu, anti-capitalist an…

> Also there's no such thing as "counterculture" in a world where culture isn't manufactured and controlled by some central authority

Oh my sweet summer child

Re: You are not your job

#248
post #234

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> [Within tribes, if] you can't do anything, at least we still love you because you are kin. That's a nice sentiment, but do you have sources for the claim that tribes universally "loved" non-productive members just because they were kin?

There are many instances of braces and artificial limbs or that were found or fossilised bones that showed crippled people that grew into old-age, which provides evidence that people cared for 'non-productive' members.

Finding evidence that disable people existed does not provide evidence that they were not able to contribute in some way. It's incredibly ableist to assume they couldn't.

Re: You are not your job

#249
post #65
post #26

>My technical skills are being disrupted by machines - that's fine I'll go do other things. [links to long bike trip] Ok that's cool and all but many of us have bills to pay. Bike trips don't pay the bills. Software people have been economically advantaged up until now that they can go and do stuff like that.

Even software people have bills to pay and mouths to feed. I think people like the article author are either single or have no dependents, and it's a big reason I cannot take many of these posts seriously. Much like the story of Peter Pan, the authors of these posts are college students who never grew up and had to be responsible.

I agree 100%.

The issue isn't losing my job. Many of us could deal with that by simply finding another similar job in the same (coding) industry. The issue is losing the entire industry.

That thing you spent years becoming good at? Getting paid lots of money for? Oh, we killed it. Start over and pick something else. You probably won't be paid well, if you can even find anything, because you're starting from ground zero and competing with all the other people flooding the job market. Oh, and yes, it'll require massive life adjustment on your part. Good luck!

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