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The American Healthcare Conundrum

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241–250 of 690 posts

Re: The American Healthcare Conundrum

#241
post #216

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> health insurers...'re on your team and benefit from lower prices just as much as you do You're missing a very, very, very important piece here. Which is that the lowest price of all is to deny treatment entirely . They are not on your team, they are the opposite team. Their revenue is basically fixed, at the level of your premiums. But the more health care they pay for you to receive, the less profit they make . Th…

No, that's not how it works. Due to the ACA minimum medical loss ratio, most health plans have no direct financial incentive to deny treatment.

It's nice to know they do it just for the love of the game.

Re: The American Healthcare Conundrum

#242

As a non-American, I find it interesting that so many comments in the thread insist that "No, American healthcare is not that expensive compared to that of other countries; no, the costs of the American healthcare system are not high due to greed and capitalism; and no, the American healthcare system cannot be cheaper or better, it is not perfect, but it works as it is."

As an American, I think most of my countrymen's arguments on the subject resemble something like "learned helplessness". The "healthcare system" is craptasm of kludges that each partly counter the fundamental irrationality of rapacious private healthcare but introduce their own idiocy. So the arguments and "ideas" involve this already dumb measure needs to be changed in that half-assed fashion. A few election cycles ago, an old woman was quoted saying "get the government out of my medicare [medicare is a state program, for foreigners trying to understand this stuff]"

Re: The American Healthcare Conundrum

#243
post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> part of the healthcare system that is moderately competitive. That’s only half the story though insurance companies also try and reject way more claims, cover fewer people, and are just harder to get money from than Medicare. This means hospitals can’t afford to give them cheaper rates as they just require vastly more work from staff for the same procedure. The industry isn’t blind to this effect, but has little re…

It can't be both: either insurers are incentivized to authorize as much care as possible so as to fit more money through the 20% opening, or they're incentivized to deny care to minimize their expenses. Which is it?

What do you mean elevators go up and down clearly someone only wants to go in one direction. If they are below 80% they want costs to increase, over 80% costs better decrease.

The ideal long term strategy is to drive everyone’s costs to go up slowly over time slightly faster than inflation. Adding administrative burden to medical institutions is a perfect way to achieve that, but clearly that never happens…

Re: The American Healthcare Conundrum

#244
Healthcare administrative overhead in the US is pretty huge and has been for a long time. Back in the early 90s I worked on claim processing software and I recall it being discussed as being around a third of healthcare costs.

Last year this podcast said that nobody wants to solve this because solving it is going to eliminate (IIRC) hundreds of thousands of jobs. Which is a point to consider.

In 2021, the U.S. spent $1,055 per capita on healthcare administration, while the second-highest country — Germany — spent just $306 per capita, Japan is $82. https://www.pgpf.org/article/almost-25-percent-of-healthcare...

Administrative spending accounts for between 15% and 30% of total medical spending, with lower estimates covering only billing- and insurance-related expenses, and higher ones including general business overhead such as quality assurance, credentialing, and profits. https://www.healthaffairs.org/do/10.1377/hpb20220909.830296/

The Center for American Progress estimates that health care payers and providers in the United States spend about $496 billion annually on billing and insurance-related (BIR) costs alone. https://www.americanprogress.org/article/excess-administrati...

The time burden on physicians is staggering — estimated at $68,000 per physician per year spent dealing with billing-related administrative matters. https://www.pgpf.org/article/almost-25-percent-of-healthcare...

Re: The American Healthcare Conundrum

#245
post #60

> The US spends ~$14,570 per person on healthcare. Japan spends ~$5,790 and has the highest life expectancy in the OECD. That gap is roughly $3 trillion per year. The difference in life expectancy will be influenced by multiple factors and may have more to do with diet and lifestyle than with healthcare. Japan also spends less per capita than the UK, France or Germany. The US spends a lot more than any of those so th…

The Japanese system is amazing. Cheap drugs, cheap dentistry, no wait times and reimbursements for all kinds of things (government covered more than 100% of childbirth cost - yes we got more back than we paid). But the best part IMO is the emphasis on preventative medicine. My wife and I get annual checkups which cover a whole range of things including screening for various kinds of cancer.

Re: The American Healthcare Conundrum

#246

Not in Maryland https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maryland_hospital_payment_syst...

All payer is really the most viable policy direction to save the US from medical bankruptcy.

Yeah, but on our way to medical bankruptcy a lot of people are going to get stinking, filthy rich on it...

Re: The American Healthcare Conundrum

#247
When you really dig into the difference it's metabolic health that is driving most of it, and that will be fixed by agricultural and food regulation for the most of it, starting with going with the whitelist system that japan and the EU have for food additives & manufacturing processes vs. the wild west that is GRAS in the USA, and way more strict food quality / inspection standards than you would think.

Re: The American Healthcare Conundrum

#248

Firey take, but health insurers are not the problem they are made out to be. They're on your team and benefit from lower prices just as much as you do. They don't make any money either, don't argue with me, buy their stocks if you are so convinced and see how that goes over. Health care providers carry immense blame. It's full of passionless people in it for the outsized paychecks, who once inside will just seek what…

If health insurers are on my team why do they blatantly lie about their network coverage to me? Why do they list providers as in-network, when the providers consider themselves out of network?

Why aren't the executives of these insurers shilling ghost networks not in prison for mail fraud?

Re: The American Healthcare Conundrum

#249

Firey take, but health insurers are not the problem they are made out to be. They're on your team and benefit from lower prices just as much as you do. They don't make any money either, don't argue with me, buy their stocks if you are so convinced and see how that goes over. Health care providers carry immense blame. It's full of passionless people in it for the outsized paychecks, who once inside will just seek what…

Having worked in medicine, I agree about providers. People who probably got in it to help people burn out immediately and become like the rest of us looking for the best paycheck with a tolerable workplace.

Insurance companies make plenty of money though. Cigna makes $7-8B per year and pays a decent dividend.

Re: The American Healthcare Conundrum

#250
post #241
post #216

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, that's not how it works. Due to the ACA minimum medical loss ratio, most health plans have no direct financial incentive to deny treatment.

It's nice to know they do it just for the love of the game.

Mostly they do it because their customers (employers that sponsor health plans) ask them to in order to hold down costs.
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