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I tried building my startup entirely on European infrastructure

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Re: I tried building my startup entirely on European infrastructure

#241

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Apple doesn’t control my production setup https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=46252114

You can setup a Mac without an Apple ID. To be honest iCloud is garbage. Almost all Mac App Store apps are available without the App Store.

I remember having a garbge Apple id just to use xcode. Back when I was desperate enough to work from a company that only issued macbooks.

Re: I tried building my startup entirely on European infrastructure

#243

What exactly is your goal in doing this? What has it brought you?

US admin is threatening the EU on multiple fronts if you haven't reading the news. Invasions of sovereign territory, dismantling the EU etc.. This is unprecedented and without merit and a lot of EU citizens and governments have reached their patience threshold and are choosing to buy elsewhere.

The US has simply casually mentioned they could turn off all access to US digital services and products that we currently pay good money for. The concern is that they might maybe not all at once but I'm not waiting to find out that they're testing the waters with a single provider.

So we're getting security and independence and promoting the EU tech scene! EU has better privacy laws as well. Before this the US was seen as a reliable ally.

Re: I tried building my startup entirely on European infrastructure

#244
I've witnessed quite a few attempts in this regard, and they're truly admirable. Although Gitea's trademark and domain are controlled by China.

From a geopolitical perspective, such attempts don't hold much significance. The EU's future doesn't lie here either. It lies more in media control, profiting from balancing between the US, China, and Russia, and even continuing to extract raw materials from former colonies through low prices or unfair contracts. This may not be glorious, but it's what's been happening all along. A vast consumer market, the influence of values, comprehensive soft power, cultural control and integration of large numbers of immigrants, and so on. "Made in EU" will never succeed.

Re: I tried building my startup entirely on European infrastructure

#245

Per "Choose Boring Technology" [0]: > Let’s say every company gets about three innovation tokens. You can spend these however you want, but the supply is fixed for a long while... If you choose to write your website in NodeJS, you just spent one of your innovation tokens. If you choose to use MongoDB, you just spent one of your innovation tokens. If you choose to use service discovery tech that’s existed for a year o…

But the argument is reversed! The more boring your tech stack, the _easier_ it is to host it anywhere (including Europe). So choosing boring tech is actually an enabler of this (and other) choices down the line.

It's only "a political commitment" as long as it doesn't affect you yet; and from the European perspective I'd say "the affecting has begun".

Re: I tried building my startup entirely on European infrastructure

#247
post #148

I just signed up up Hetzner Their menu has: - Console - konsoleH - Robot - DNS When I click into Console I get an additional option called "Website" I have no idea what Robot and konsoleH are. Is it a prerequisite if you make a cloud platform to make your offering as confusing as possible?

It's funny that you say that because any time I sign in to one of the big cloud providers I wonder how anyone gets any work done there _at all_...

But to answer your question it's the top one from the menu and then you get a page that couldn't be more clear (IMHO as a customer)

Re: I tried building my startup entirely on European infrastructure

#248

AWS does have a European sovereign cloud now: https://aws.amazon.com/blogs/aws/opening-the-aws-european-so... Now how bulletproof it is in practice will be tested in years to come, I'm sure. But it seems to be using the same model as AWS in China where a local company licenses and operates the software from AWS.

>Now how bulletproof it is in practice will be tested in years to come

Zero chance the data stays in the EU. Just think about it for a moment. US CLOUD Act directly conflicts with EUs GDPR. Amazon doesn't want to risk losing EU markets but it can't lose the US market by not complying with US law.

If these two conflict Amazon will side with the US. The savvy business move is to pretend to serve the EU market exclusively while privately adhering to the US demands.

Re: I tried building my startup entirely on European infrastructure

#249

Per "Choose Boring Technology" [0]: > Let’s say every company gets about three innovation tokens. You can spend these however you want, but the supply is fixed for a long while... If you choose to write your website in NodeJS, you just spent one of your innovation tokens. If you choose to use MongoDB, you just spent one of your innovation tokens. If you choose to use service discovery tech that’s existed for a year o…

But the argument is reversed! The more boring your tech stack, the _easier_ it is to host it anywhere (including Europe). So choosing boring tech is actually an enabler of this (and other) choices down the line. It's only "a political commitment" as long as it doesn't affect you yet; and from the European perspective I'd say "the affecting has begun".

I'd say from this author's POV, his commitments cost him in terms of headaches, costs, and time not spent optimizing for meeting customers' needs:

> The parts that were extra hard

> Transactional email with competitive pricing. This one surprised me. Sendgrid, Postmark, Mailgun, they all make it trivially easy and reasonably cheap. The EU options exist, but finding one that matches on deliverability, pricing, and developer experience took real effort. Scaleway's TEM works, but the ecosystem is thinner. Fewer templates, fewer integrations, less community knowledge to lean on when something goes wrong.

The choose boring technology essay notes that as you get further along you might get more innovation tokens to spend. but when you're starting out, "not choosing sendgrid because they're American" is a token gone when they're most scarce.

Re: I tried building my startup entirely on European infrastructure

#250
post #141

If you dig one step beyond hetzner you should start to see that the whole thing is unavoidably global. There is no truly dominant monopoly holder anywhere. Who makes the photolithography machines? What about those weird Japanese companies that make chemicals and substrates that no one else can?

Once the chips are there in a EU datacenter, no geopolitical change can bring them away. And that already makes some difference.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intel_Management_Engine
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