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AI is a business model stress test

dri.es

241–250 of 361 posts

Re: AI is a business model stress test

#241

In my opinion LLMs are intellectual property theft. Just as if I started distributing copies of books. This substantially reduces the incentive for the creation of new IP. All written text, art work, etc needs to come imbued with a GPL style license: if you train your model on this, your weights and training code must be published.

I think there is a real issue here, but I do not think it is as simple as calling it theft in the same way as copying books. The bigger problem is incentives. We built a system where writing docs, tutorials, and open technical content paid off indirectly through traffic, subscriptions, or services. LLMs get a lot of value from that work, but they also break the loop that used to send value back to the people and comp…

> I do not think it is as simple as calling it theft in the same way as copying books

Aside from the incentive problem, there is a kind of theft, known as conversion: when you were granted a license under some conditions, and you went beyond them - you kept the car past your rental date, etc. In this case, the documentation is for people to read; AI using it to answer questions is a kind of conversion (no, not fair use). But these license limits are mostly implicit in the assumption that (only) people are reading, or buried in unenforceable site terms of use. So it's a squishy kind of stealing after breaching a squishy kind of contract - too fuzzy to stop incented parties.

Re: AI is a business model stress test

#242

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People like tailwind because it feels like the correct abstraction. It helps you colocate layout and styling, thereby reducing cognitive load. With CSS you have to add meaningless class names to your html (+remember them), learn complicated (+fragile) selectors, and memorise low level CSS styles. With tailwind you just specify the styling you want. And if using React, the “cascading” piece is already taken care of.

The point of CSS is specifically to separate styling and semantics, so that they are not tightly coupled. If you were writing a blog post you would want to be able to change the theme without going through every blog post you ever wrote, no? If I'm writing a React component I don't want it tightly coupled to its cosmetic appearance for the same reason. Styling is imposed on elements, intrinsic styles are bad and work…

> The point of CSS is specifically to separate styling and semantics, so that they are not tightly coupled.

That was the original point, and it turned out that nobody cares about that 99% of the time. It's premature optimization and it violates "YAGNI". And in addition to not being something most people need, it's just a pain to set and remember and organize class names and organize files.

Remember CSS Zen Garden from the late 90s? How many sites actually do anything like that? Almost none.

And the beauty of Tailwind is, when you actually do need themes, that's the only stuff you have to name and organize in separate CSS files. Instead of having to do that with literally all of your CSS.

Re: AI is a business model stress test

#243
post #98

Tailwind Labs relied on a weird monetization scheme. Revenue was proportional to the pain of using the framework. The sudden improvement in getting desired UI without relying on pre-built templates killed Tailwind Labs. There are many initiatives in a similar spot, improving your experience at using Next.js would hurt Vercel. Making GitHub actions runners more reliable, stable and economical would hurt Microsoft. Imp…

> If suddenly CSS became pleasant to use, Tailwind would be in a rough spot. CSS is pleasant to use. I know I find it pleasant to use; and I know there are quite a few frontend developers who do too. I didn't pay much attention to tailwind, until suddenly I realized that it has spread like wildfire and now is everywhere. What drove that growth? Which groups were the first adopters of tailwind; how did they grow; when…

> CSS is pleasant

So is SQL. To me. But some otherwise rational people have an irrational dislike of sql. Almost like someone seeking to seal a small bruise with wire mesh because bandaids are hard to rip off. The consequence shows with poorly implemented schema-free nosql and bloated orm tools mixed in with sql.

But some folks just like it that way. And most reasons boil down to a combination of (1) a myopic solution to a hyper specific usecase or (2) an enterprise situation where you have a codebase written by monkeys with keyboards and you want to limit their powers for good or (3) koolaid infused resume driven development.

Re: AI is a business model stress test

#244
post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If suddenly CSS became pleasant to use, Tailwind would be in a rough spot. CSS is pleasant to use. I know I find it pleasant to use; and I know there are quite a few frontend developers who do too. I didn't pay much attention to tailwind, until suddenly I realized that it has spread like wildfire and now is everywhere. What drove that growth? Which groups were the first adopters of tailwind; how did they grow; when…

Writing CSS manually was never all that pleasant for me, mostly the part about debugging it when it doesn't do what I want. So I tried Tailwind and it seemed to help. But now that Claude Opus 4.5 is writing all my code, it can write and debug CSS better than I can use Tailwind. So, CSS it is.

Debugging CSS nowadays is way easier than even 5 years ago. There are a lot of cool browser debugging tools for animations, z-indexes. The browsers have come a long way since firebug. Definitely look into both chrome or firefox, their tooling is great. Especially firefox, they have debugging tools where you can create css shapes in the browser and save them. Very handy for those artsy fartsy sites.

Re: AI is a business model stress test

#245

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How does this support your point? If we're saying "they fixed it because there was pressure to"... okay? That's the parents point - tons of people are going to move off over bad performance, and Github was incentivized to fix it when people started moving off. If Github's incentive was to keep it slow... we wouldn't have seen exactly what you're describing.

The fix already existed and was neglected for a decade. It was a 3 lines of bash code. The big would commonly make a runner hang forever unnoticed, on a platform that charged by the minute. One minute hanging, was one minute charged. The fix that would drop considerably the amount of total minutes charged was immediately followed by charging self hosted runners by the minute. >GitHub incentive was to make it fast. Th…

Link?

Re: AI is a business model stress test

#246

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think there is a real issue here, but I do not think it is as simple as calling it theft in the same way as copying books. The bigger problem is incentives. We built a system where writing docs, tutorials, and open technical content paid off indirectly through traffic, subscriptions, or services. LLMs get a lot of value from that work, but they also break the loop that used to send value back to the people and comp…

It's not as simple as calling it theft, but it is simply theft, plus the other good points you made.

Copying is theft, generating is theft, and it is not even taking anything they had. Future revenue can't be stolen.

I think once it becomes infrastructure and widely used knowledge the authors can't claim control anymore. Or shouldn't.

Re: AI is a business model stress test

#247

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The point of CSS is specifically to separate styling and semantics, so that they are not tightly coupled. If you were writing a blog post you would want to be able to change the theme without going through every blog post you ever wrote, no? If I'm writing a React component I don't want it tightly coupled to its cosmetic appearance for the same reason. Styling is imposed on elements, intrinsic styles are bad and work…

You’re kinda late to the party. 15 years ago that was the way to build UIs, but componentization changed that. Now we reason about UIs as blocks, not as pages, so collocation of logic, markup, and style makes the most sense. Not to say that every component should be unique, generic components can be built in an extensible way, and users can extend those components while applying unique styling. Theming is also a solv…

In the webdev world being late is the same as being early. Just wait for the pendulum to swing back.

Tailwind is like GenZ has discovered the bgcolor="" attribute.

> Markup and styling are intrinsically linked, making any change to the markup most likely will require changes to the styling, and vice versa.

No, not vice versa. It's only in one direction. Changing the component requires changing styles, but changing styles doesn't require changing the component if it's merely cosmetic. If I have a button and I want to make it red the button doesn't have to know what color it is.

Re: AI is a business model stress test

#248
post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree. I actually think CSS (and SQL or other “perfectly functional” interfaces) hold some kind of special power when it comes to AI. I still feel that the main revolution of AI/LLMs will be in authoring text for such “perfectly functional”-text bases interfaces. For example, building a “powerful and rich” query experience for any product I worked on was always an exercise in frustration. You know all the data is t…

Hey! Don't you dare to compare SQL and CSS. SQL is not a cobbled together mess of incremental updates with 5 imperfect ways of achieving common tasks that interact in weird ways. Writing everything in SQL-92 in 2026 is not gonna get you weird looks or lock you out of features relevant for end users. If writing SQL for your problem feels difficult it's a good sign you ought to look at alternatives (eg. use multiple st…

> Don't you dare to compare SQL and CSS. SQL is not a cobbled together mess of incremental updates with 5 imperfect ways of achieving common tasks that interact in weird ways.

Reminds me a little bit of Sascha Baron Cohen's democracy speech [1] in The Dictator ;-)

Both SQL and CSS have evolved through different versions and vendor specific flavors, and have accumulated warts and different ways to do the same thing. Both feel like a superpower once you have mastered them, but painful to get anything done while learning due to the steep learning curve.

[1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XUSiCEx3e-0

Re: AI is a business model stress test

#250

In my opinion LLMs are intellectual property theft. Just as if I started distributing copies of books. This substantially reduces the incentive for the creation of new IP. All written text, art work, etc needs to come imbued with a GPL style license: if you train your model on this, your weights and training code must be published.

If I was able to memorize every pixel value to reconstruct a movie from memory, would that be theft?

>If I was able to memorize every pixel value to reconstruct a movie from memory, would that be theft?

Don an experiment, memorize a popular small poem, then publish it under your name (though I suggest to check the laws in your rtegion for this and also consider it might affect your reputation).

IMO is the same if ChatGPT memorizes my poem and then you ask it for a poem , you copy paste my poem from ChatGPT and publish it as your own.

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