Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Can I start using Wayland in 2026?

michael.stapelberg.ch

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

241–250 of 335 posts

Re: Can I start using Wayland in 2026?

#241

Post by shadowpho »

zouhair wrote: post #76
ryandrake wrote: post #7

I still don't know why I would want to use it. The benefits don't seem to outweigh the costs yet, and xorg is tried and true. So many Linux articles and forum posts about fixing problems with your desktop graphics start with "If you're using Wayland, go back to xorg, it'll probably fix the problem you're seeing." You don't always have to replace something that works with something that doesn't but is "modern." My gue…

For me mainly better HDR implementation.

Does X even support hdr yet? When I looked last time the answer was none

Re: Can I start using Wayland in 2026?

#242

Post by throwaway270925 »

theragra wrote: post #231
jcelerier wrote: post #184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Windows and Mac Os, for all their faults, are unquestionably ready to use in 2026. LOL I installed a new windows 11 yesterday on a fairly powerful machine, everything lags so much on a brand new install it's unreal. Explorer takes ~2-3 seconds to be useable. Any app that opens in the blink of an eye under Linux on the same machine takes seconds to start. Start menu lags. It's just surrealistic. People who say these…

I am not sure how people get all these issues. I installed fresh windows recently, and I don't see noticable any slowdowns. Linux is faster in some places, maybe. But still with many issues like some applications not being drawn properly or just some applications not available (nice GUI for monitor control over ddc)

There is:

https://github.com/rockowitz/ddcui

Re: Can I start using Wayland in 2026?

#243

Post by michaelmrose »

vladvasiliu wrote: post #198
michaelmrose wrote: post #165

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why not 200% and increase font size slightly in all 3 cases?

Because although I don't care much about the chrome, I sometimes have to use it. For example, the address bar in firefox is ridiculously small. Also, some apps, like firefox (again) have a weird adaptation of the scroll to the zoom. So if you zoom at 300%, it will scroll by a lot at a time, whereas 200% is still usable. Also, 200% on an FHD 14" laptop means 960x540 px equivalent. That's too big to the point of render…

14 fhd is 157 ppi 24 4k is 184 ppi

This really isn't this far off. If we imagined the screens overlayed semi-transparently an 16 pixel letter would be over a 14 pixel one.

If one imagines an ideal font size for a given user's preference for physical height of letterform one one could imagine a idealized size of 12 on another and 14 on the other and setting it to 13 and being extremely close to ideal.

>So if you zoom at 300%, it will scroll by a lot at a time, whereas 200% is still usable.

This is because it's scrolling a fixed number of lines which occupy more space at 300% zoom notably this applies pretty much only to people running high DPI screens at 100% because if one zoomed to 300% otherwise the letter T would be the size of the last joint on your thumb and legally blind folks could read it. It doesn't apply to setting the scale factor to 200% nor the setting for Firefox's internal scale factor which is independent from the desktop supports fractional scaling in 0.05 steps and can be configured in about:config

layout.css.devPixelsPerPx

Re: Can I start using Wayland in 2026?

#244

Post by charmicat »

com wrote: post #111
Phelinofist wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Out of curiosity, what are these workflows?

I don’t use x2x but use xev and xdotool for automated regression testing of GUI tools. I can’t find a low-effort, high-portability, low-menory way to do it with Wayland. Local and also in CI pipelines.

wev+ydotool?

Re: Can I start using Wayland in 2026?

#245

Post by tuna74 »

naikrovek wrote: post #168
exe34 wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, this was a major point of discussion right at the start. They chose to ignore it.

They should have looked at Plan9 and the Rio window manager there. I don’t know how GPU acceleration would have fit in, but I bet it would have been trivial provided the drivers were sufficient. All of Rio in Plan9 is 6K lines of code and it’s a more powerful display protocol and window manager (all of the fundamentals are there but none of the niceties) than anything else I’ve ever seen. The defacto way to remote in…

The beauty with Free Software and Linux distros is that "they" don't have to do it, anyone who wants to (including you!) can do it.

Re: Can I start using Wayland in 2026?

#246

Post by tuna74 »

zmarty wrote: post #195
popcornricecake wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Flawless on AMD? Absolutely not. 2-3 years ago there used to be a amdgpu bug that froze my entire laptop randomly with no recourse beyond the 4 second power button press. After that was fixed, it sometimes got stuck on shutdown. Now it doesn't do that randomly anymore, but yet all it takes to break it, is to turn off the power to my external monitor (or the monitor powering off by itself to save energy) or unplugging…

AMD iGPU driver is broken for me right this very moment: https://issues.chromium.org/issues/442860477?pli=1

Clarification: The AMD iGPU driver (or Chrome) on Ubuntu 24.04 has bugs on your hardware. You could try a newer and different distro (just using a live-USB) to see if that has been fixed.

Re: Can I start using Wayland in 2026?

#247

Post by tuna74 »

ur-whale wrote: post #62

I must say: 1) Hugely enjoyable content - as usual - by Michael Stapelberg: relevant, detailed, organized, well written. 2) I am also an X11 + i3 user (and huge thanks to Michael for writing i3, I'm soooo fast with it), I also keep trying wayland on a regular basis because I don't want to get stuck using deprecated software. I am very, very happy to read this article, if only because it proves I'm not the only one an…

You are totally free to work on whatever you want to. You don't have to use the software that the Wayland devs (and other developers that like Wayland) produces. You can use and code whatever you want.

Re: Can I start using Wayland in 2026?

#248

Post by GCUMstlyHarmls »

simoncion wrote: post #174
GCUMstlyHarmls wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Taking the proposition as true, what goal does Redhat have in "forcing wayland on users"? I am asking this in good faith, I literally naively do not understand what the "bad" bit is. Like, ok, its 2030 and X11 is dead, no one works on it anymore and 90% of Linux users use Wayland, what did they gain? I know they did employ Pottering but not anymore, and AFAIK they contribute a non-trivial amount of code up stream to,…

> ...what goal does Redhat have in "forcing wayland on users"? The same goal any group of savvy corporate employees has when their marquee project has proved to be far more difficult, taken way longer, and required far more resources than anticipated to get within artillery distance of its originally-stated goal? I've personally seen this sort of thing play out several times during my tenure in the corporate environm…

I honestly dont know what that means, I've never worked in a big company/corporation. Try and disown it? How does that fit with xlibres anti-corporate control stance? I guess it they push wayland then drop it, we're left with X11 ignored and a non-financially supported alternative?

I guess I just don't get how the third E in EEE plays out in an open source environment.

Re: Can I start using Wayland in 2026?

#249

Post by GCUMstlyHarmls »

GCUMstlyHarmls wrote: post #70
safety1st wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Looks to me like he's a belligerent personality, but probably not wrong when he says Redhat has an agenda that involves suppressing progress on Xorg and forcing Wayland on users instead. I was open minded toward Wayland when the project was started... in 2008. We are 18 years down the road now. It has failed to deliver a usable piece of software for the desktop. That's long enough for me to consider it a failed proje…

Taking the proposition as true, what goal does Redhat have in "forcing wayland on users"? I am asking this in good faith, I literally naively do not understand what the "bad" bit is. Like, ok, its 2030 and X11 is dead, no one works on it anymore and 90% of Linux users use Wayland, what did they gain? I know they did employ Pottering but not anymore, and AFAIK they contribute a non-trivial amount of code up stream to,…

Cant Edit: I mention Pottering above because I remember similar arguments against his stuff (that I also never really fully understood in terms of "end game"), not because I have personal animosity against him or his projects or want to hold him up as "example of what can go wrong".

Re: Can I start using Wayland in 2026?

#250

Post by simondotau »

charcircuit wrote: post #125
simondotau wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sorry but you’re just wrong. Explore.exe and Dock.app are nere user interfaces and are not involved in the render pipeline of other apps.

I am talking about window management. Window management is about controling windows, windows managers should not care about how windows are rendered.

Explorer.exe and Dock.app have nothing to do with anything anyone is talking about here.
Post reply on HN