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Clair Obscur having its Indie Game Game Of The Year award stripped due to AI use

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Re: Clair Obscur having its Indie Game Game Of The Year award stripped due to AI use

#241

Post by PunchyHamster »

AssassinDuck wrote: post #180
10xDev wrote: post #120

You need to separate AI usage from automating certain parts of a pipeline from end to end creation. Taking a scorched earth approach to AI usage is just being a luddite.

I don't think this argument is going to be very compelling. The people whom you would be trying to convince here, would just argue that the Luddites were correct in their fight against human labor being displaced. They'll argue that the power artisans had over their work was diminished with the advent of the loom, just like the power artists have over their labor is being diminished right now.

That's very easy problem to solve, take the things from them that were created thanks to problems, they will change mind quickly

Re: Clair Obscur having its Indie Game Game Of The Year award stripped due to AI use

#242

Post by asadotzler »

andrewstuart wrote: post #41

Well that’s a rule that makes no sense. These awards are behind the times and risk irrelevance. What software in 2025 is written without AI help? Every game released recently would have AI help.

If you join a contest with a rule that doesn't make sense, lie about following the rule when you did not, and the contest disqualifies you, it's not the rule that's the problem, it's the lying about complying with the rule when you did not. Are you really so confused by this whole thign that you don't get that or are you just another Big Tech AI fanbro?

Re: Clair Obscur having its Indie Game Game Of The Year award stripped due to AI use

#243

Post by PunchyHamster »

blackbrokkoli wrote: post #13

Is anyone else detecting a phase shift in LLM criticism? Of course you could always find opinion pieces, blogs and nerdy forum comments that disliked AI; but it appears to me that hate for AI gen content is now hitting mainstream contexts, normie contexts. Feels like my grandma may soon have an opinion on this. No idea what the implications are or even if this is actually something that's happening, but I think it's…

It's because amount of AI slop bombarding people from every side increased and created knee-jerk reaction to anything AI, even if it is actually the "remove the boring part of work"

Re: Clair Obscur having its Indie Game Game Of The Year award stripped due to AI use

#244

Post by dathinab »

Kim_Bruning wrote: post #200

The game won GOTY on its merits. Then the AI disclosure came out and it got stripped. If AI use produces obviously inferior work, how did it win in the first place? Seems like the objection is to the process, not the result. Doubly so if the usage was de minimis. I think it's the artists, not the tools, that make the art. Overuse of anything is gauche; but I am confident that beautiful things can be made with almost…

> If AI use produces obviously inferior work, how did it win in the first place?

they uses some AI placeholders during development as it can majorly speed up/unblock the dev loop while not really having any ethical issues (as you still hire artists to produce all the final assets) and in some corner case they forgot to replace the place holder

also some of the tooling they might have used might technically count as gen AI, e.g. way before LLM became big I had dabbled a bit in gen AI and there where some decent line work smoothing algorithms and similar with non of the ethical questions. Tools which help removing some dump annoying overhead for artists but don't replace "creative work". But which anyway are technical gen AI...

I think this mainly shows that a blank ban on "gen AI" instead of one of idk. "gen AI used in ways which replaces Artists" is kinda tone deaf/unproductive.

Re: Clair Obscur having its Indie Game Game Of The Year award stripped due to AI use

#245

Post by quectophoton »

theshrike79 wrote: post #155
sergioisidoro wrote: post #121

This is crazy. Tools like photoshoot have gen ai tools in them. Does that mean that Photoshop is now a minefield for artists? If a single artist uses the wrong tool once they disqualify the entire final product for awards, even if the asset is fully removed on the final build.

IDEs now have “AI” autocomplete; will a game become ineligible if a single dev accidentally presses tab instead of writing the whole function by hand? If a script writer uses ChatGPT to generate ideas, straight up ban? Where does the organisation intend to draw the line?

Better blacklist Google as well. You don't want anyone on the team searching anything on Google lest their search accidentally triggers the LLM response (meaning: they prompted Google Gemini).

Re: Clair Obscur having its Indie Game Game Of The Year award stripped due to AI use

#246

Post by PunchyHamster »

sph wrote: post #184
dragonwriter wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, AFAICT, AI hate has been common (but not the majority position, and still not) in normie contexts for a while.

You’re reading it wrong: rather, AI hype had been common (but not the majority position) in tech contexts for a while, especially from those that have something to sell you. What you derogatorily call normies are the rest of the world caring about their business until one day some tech wiz came around to say “hey, I have built a machine to replace all of you! Our next goal is to invent something even smarter under ou…

They don't call normies derogatorily, they just use it as proxy for "non-tech people"

> “hey, I have built a machine to replace all of you! Our next goal is to invent something even smarter under our control. Wouldn’t that be neat?” No wonder the average person isn’t really keen on this sort of development.

Nope, most are just annoyed from AI slop bombarding them at every corner, AI scams getting news of claiming another poor grandma, and AI tech industry making shit expensive. Most people's job are not in current direct threat of being employed, unless you work in tech or art.

Re: Clair Obscur having its Indie Game Game Of The Year award stripped due to AI use

#247

Post by PunchyHamster »

theshrike79 wrote: post #150
GaryBluto wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People were told by other people to dislike LLMs and so they did, then told other people themselves.

Ha! You’re actually exactly right. We’ve observed this in AI gen ads (or “creatives” as ad people call them) They work really well, EXCEPT if there is a comment option next to the ad - if people see others calling the art “AI crap” the click rate drops drastically :)

yes, having some transparency is terrible to PR

Re: Clair Obscur having its Indie Game Game Of The Year award stripped due to AI use

#248

Post by itishappy »

dathinab wrote: post #232
thiht wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That’s incredibly harsh. A blanket ban on AI generated assets is dumb as hell. Generating placeholder assets is completely acceptable.

it's even worse then that there is a whole basked of technologies which you can label as "gen AI" but which have non of the problems why people hate "gen AI" as a very dump example, some pretty decent "line smoothing" algorithm are technically gen AI but have non of the ethical issues

Is this actually a problem? Is there anybody actually arguing against line smoothing algorithms?

Re: Clair Obscur having its Indie Game Game Of The Year award stripped due to AI use

#249

Post by Majromax »

dragonelite wrote: post #224

When it comes to AI im more of a luddite at the moment, things change like every 6 months when it comes to prompting the models. But i don't mind people using AI it's their own choice, the focus then just becomes in the curation skill of the individual, team, company etc of the generated AI output. So taking away the award is kind of weak given people enjoyed the game.

> When it comes to AI im more of a luddite at the moment, things change like every 6 months when it comes to prompting the models. [...] So taking away the award is kind of weak given people enjoyed the game.

To nitpick: the independent game awards are the Luddites here. The Luddites were a protest movement, not just a group of people unfamiliar with technology.

In the historical context that's apparently become appropriate again, Luddites violently protested the disruptive introduction of new automation in the textile industry that they argued led to reduced wages, precarious employment, and de-skilling.

Re: Clair Obscur having its Indie Game Game Of The Year award stripped due to AI use

#250

Post by sokoloff »

craftkiller wrote: post #228
Alcor wrote: post #225

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s not dumb, it’s accounting for real world variance in car speedometer accuracy and possible inaccuracies in the measurement process, just because your car is telling you you went 98 or the speed camera is telling you you went 101 doesn’t mean that was the actual speed of your car at the moment.

Speed limits are limits, not targets. That's why they're called speed *limits*. You account for variance in the speedometer and the reading device by staying under the limit, not treating it as a target.

As a driver, I control my speed for a variety of factors, but I assume no responsibility for the variance in the speed checking device. That’s on the people deploying them to ensure they’ve done their job (and is part of the reason tickets aren’t issued for 1kph/1mph over in most jurisdictions).
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