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LAPD helicopter tracker with real-time operating costs

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Re: LAPD helicopter tracker with real-time operating costs

#241

Post by jeltz »

nenxk wrote: post #228
Zigurd wrote: post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Same reason that nearly every police response in the US is an armed response. Same reason police kill more Americans than terrorists do. US police culture is toxic and deadly. Several cities tightly restrict high-speed chases. That should be the norm.

Restricted high speed chases lead to a lot more crime though there’s some car thief’s I’ve watched on insta and they avoid LA and stick to Oakland because of the chase laws you also have people in New York like squeeze benz, license, doolie, and a lot more who have made entire social media careers driving around recklessly and getting into crashes on freeways because they won’t get chased more than a mile there’s bee…

Not sure why car chases are necessary to solve this problem. Just arrest these people in their homes. Those videos are enough evidence for arrest and conviction.

Re: LAPD helicopter tracker with real-time operating costs

#242

Post by lukeschlather »

closeparen wrote: post #227
Zigurd wrote: post #219

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Crime is down. Not because we have aggressive cops that shoot people a lot. https://counciloncj.org/crime-trends-in-u-s-cities-mid-year-...

Okay, and? As long as crime is below its peak level, there’s no need to apprehend criminals?

Shooting people and high speed chases are bad tools for apprehending criminals. They are more likely to harm innocent people than criminals. Facing off with "violent and brazen" criminals doesn't change this, but also the fact that crime is down suggests US criminals are in fact, neither more violent nor more brazen than those in areas where police use less destructive methods.

Re: LAPD helicopter tracker with real-time operating costs

#243

Post by hkpack »

speakfreely wrote: post #213
dns_snek wrote: post #176

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of course they're not optional, but you shouldn't be starting a high speed pursuit over a seat belt violation, or for someone going 5 over the speed limit. Principle of proportionality should apply, you shouldn't be risking the lives of the public over anything but the most serious offences where them getting away poses a greater threat to the public than potentially killing a bystander.

> you shouldn't be starting a high speed pursuit over a seat belt violation, or for someone going 5 over the speed limit. That's the thing: normal people don't. Violent criminals, people with active arrest warrants, and people carrying highly illegal/dangerous things in their vehicles are the types that run from traffic stops.

What about depressed people? What about stressed people? What about people with autism who overreact when spooked? What about people on the edge who didn't care about the consequences because of the life situation?

What about people who are convinced that police may kill them for mild violation as they saw that multiple times on the news and social media? The reaction to flee may be justified at the moment as it is life or death anyway, even if only in their heads.

There are a lot of "normal" people around who will act abnormally in a high stress situation.

Re: LAPD helicopter tracker with real-time operating costs

#244

Post by lukeschlather »

themafia wrote: post #200
marcinzm wrote: post #199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Greater LA areas has 34k square miles of area. Germany, the whole country, has 128k square miles. In other words, the LA area alone is a quarter the size of all of Germany.

A huge chunk of that is national parks and deserts. It's not all inhabited. Only about 25% is classified as urban with the overwhelming majority of that being concentrated in Los Angeles and it's surrounding cities. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greater_Los_Angeles#Urban_area... This isn't a size measuring contest. I think Europeans forget how _young_ America is. That's the only unique part of this country. Give us a…

No it was a population density measuring contest and you were trying to argue that greater LA was more dense than greater Berlin, without defining greater Berlin in a rigorous way. The size of Germany relative to greater LA was brought up to attempt to put the population densities in perspective.

Re: LAPD helicopter tracker with real-time operating costs

#245

Post by nradov »

lukan wrote: post #172
nradov wrote: post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Perfect how? The license plate scanner can only tell that a particular plate number was in a particular place at a particular time. It doesn't know if the plate was fake or stolen, or who was driving the vehicle, or if there was contraband in the vehicle. Stopping fleeing vehicles is one of the most effective ways to catch people with outstanding arrest warrants and get illegal weapons off the streets.

I think the idea is, if you know where the car is and where it is going, you don't need to chase it openly on high traffic areas with high risk of accidents. You use restraint and take them at a safer place. (surely won't work all the time)

You don't know where it's going.

Re: LAPD helicopter tracker with real-time operating costs

#246

Post by slg »

boringg wrote: post #216
Zigurd wrote: post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Same reason that nearly every police response in the US is an armed response. Same reason police kill more Americans than terrorists do. US police culture is toxic and deadly. Several cities tightly restrict high-speed chases. That should be the norm.

That may be - it should be noted that criminals in the US are also much more violent and brazen then most of the rest of the planet. If your criminal population is packing heat the response tends to be much more aggressive. Its a bit cat and mouse.

This is a perfect summary of that "toxic and deadly" culture. Why are police treated as a dumb tool that will always respond to violence with more violence? Why is the onus on the criminals to deescalate the situation? Why doesn't the duty of enforcing the law come with a bigger burden to keeping the peace? And why do the police not have any culpability in violence they helped escalate?

Re: LAPD helicopter tracker with real-time operating costs

#247

Post by 0xbadcafebee »

free_bip wrote: post #181
mike_d wrote: post #177

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The report is wrong. If you bother to watch LA news you'll see they are used a few times a night to track vehicles from the air. This frees up ground units and avoids high speed chases which saves lives. It's fun to call this a waste of taxpayer dollars until you watch a carjacked vehicle recovered with kids inside.

Do you really need 17 helicopters and 90 employees for the occasional car chase? This feels wildly over the top. They could do that just fine with one third the resources.

On top of that, police car chases are wildly harmful and usually started from things like minor traffic violations: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wVFXUkFx5Y8

Re: LAPD helicopter tracker with real-time operating costs

#248

Post by ACCount37 »

jeltz wrote: post #241
nenxk wrote: post #228

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Restricted high speed chases lead to a lot more crime though there’s some car thief’s I’ve watched on insta and they avoid LA and stick to Oakland because of the chase laws you also have people in New York like squeeze benz, license, doolie, and a lot more who have made entire social media careers driving around recklessly and getting into crashes on freeways because they won’t get chased more than a mile there’s bee…

Not sure why car chases are necessary to solve this problem. Just arrest these people in their homes. Those videos are enough evidence for arrest and conviction.

Who do you arrest? An abandoned car?

Re: LAPD helicopter tracker with real-time operating costs

#249

Post by jayd16 »

BadBadJellyBean wrote: post #55
shoddydoordesk wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are high speed police chases (100mph+) in Los Angeles — no exaggeration — on an almost daily basis. Air support is the primary defense tool for law enforcement. It's so bad that the local TV stations have their own choppers and a dedicated on-screen UI tailored for the chases with GPS-based tracking and speed. If you're lucky you can catch one of the many YouTube live streams. Here's one from....two days ago: h…

Then why do you have so many car chases? That seems like an odd problem. There must be a reason.

Because the police chase them.

Re: LAPD helicopter tracker with real-time operating costs

#250

Post by [deleted] »

gosub100 wrote: post #225
BadBadJellyBean wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then why do you have so many car chases? That seems like an odd problem. There must be a reason.

Because our society is spoiled, averse to consequences, and addicted to pleasure. People cannot tolerate it when they don't get what they want. What they want (when being pulled over) is NOT to go to jail, hence, due their conditioning, they avoid the consequence. Up to and including bringing injury and death onto themselves and strangers.

[deleted]
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