Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Uv is the best thing to happen to the Python ecosystem in a decade

emily.space

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

241–250 of 1001 posts

Re: Uv is the best thing to happen to the Python ecosystem in a decade

#241

Post by internetter »

pydry wrote: post #188
hardwaregeek wrote: post #149

I gotta say, I feel pretty vindicated after hearing for years how Python’s tooling was just fine and you should just use virtualenv with pip and how JS must be worse, that when Python devs finally get a taste of npm/cargo/bundler in their ecosystem, they freaking love it. Because yes, npm has its issues but lock files and consistent installs are amazing

>finally get a taste of npm good god no thank you. >cargo more like it.

cargo is better than npm, yes, but npm is better than pip (in my experience)

Re: Uv is the best thing to happen to the Python ecosystem in a decade

#242

Post by j2kun »

xmprt wrote: post #72
kyt wrote: post #21

I must be the odd man out but I am not a fan of uv. 1. It tries to do too many things. Please just do one thing and do it well. It's simultaneously trying to replace pip, pyenv, virtualenv, and ruff in one command. 2. You end up needing to use `uv pip` so it's not even a full replacement for pip. 3. It does not play well with Docker. 4. It adds more complexity. You end up needing to understand all of these new enviro…

Your implication is that pyenv, virtualenv, and pip should be 3 different tools. But for the average developer, these tools are all related to managing the python environment and versions which in my head sounds like one thing. Other languages don't have 3 different tools for this. pip and virtualenv also add a ton of complexity and when they break (which happens quite often) debugging it is even harder despite them…

I think OP's complaint is rather that using `uv` is leaky: now you need to learn all the underlying stuff AND uv as well.

The alternative, of course, is having Python natively support a combined tool. Which you can support while also not liking `uv` for the above reason.

Re: Uv is the best thing to happen to the Python ecosystem in a decade

#243

Post by mannicken »

God yes. I got dragged into the uv when I started using copyparty and I am a fanatical admirer ever since. I also use pipx to install tools often. I really don't understand why you can't just pip install something globally. I want this package to be available to me EVERYWHERE, why can't I do it? I only use python recreationally because everyone uses python everywhere and you can't escape it. So there is a massive possibility I am simply wrong and pip-installing something globally is a huge risk. I'm just not understanding it.

Re: Uv is the best thing to happen to the Python ecosystem in a decade

#244

Post by collinmanderson »

j2kun wrote: post #230

This article appears to be NOT about someone who discovered uv after using venv/pip, but rather an article about someone who discovered uv after not using virtual environments at all, and is mostly excited about the cleanliness of virtual environments.

The article shows some advantages compared to plain virtual environments:

In principle, you can ‘activate’ this new virtual environment like any typical virtual environment that you may have seen in other tools, but the most ‘uv-onic’ way to use uv is simply to prepend any command with uv run. This command automatically picks up the correct virtual environment for you and runs your command with it. For instance, to run a script — instead of

   source .venv/bin/activate
   python myscript.py
you can just do

   uv run myscript.py

Re: Uv is the best thing to happen to the Python ecosystem in a decade

#245

Post by nullbyte »

chrisweekly wrote: post #214
hardwaregeek wrote: post #149

I gotta say, I feel pretty vindicated after hearing for years how Python’s tooling was just fine and you should just use virtualenv with pip and how JS must be worse, that when Python devs finally get a taste of npm/cargo/bundler in their ecosystem, they freaking love it. Because yes, npm has its issues but lock files and consistent installs are amazing

Webdev since 1998 here. Tabling the python vs JS/etc to comment on npm per se. PNPM is better than npm in every way. Strongest possible recommendation to use it instead of npm; it's faster, more efficient, safer, and more deterministic. See https://pnpm.io/motivation

I find pnpm annoying to type, that's why I don't use it

Re: Uv is the best thing to happen to the Python ecosystem in a decade

#246

Post by icedchai »

mk89 wrote: post #239
hardwaregeek wrote: post #149

I gotta say, I feel pretty vindicated after hearing for years how Python’s tooling was just fine and you should just use virtualenv with pip and how JS must be worse, that when Python devs finally get a taste of npm/cargo/bundler in their ecosystem, they freaking love it. Because yes, npm has its issues but lock files and consistent installs are amazing

I have used pip freeze > requirements.txt pip install -r requirements.txt Way before "official" lockfile existed. Your requirements.txt becomes a lockfile, as long as you accept to not use ranges. Having this in a single tool etc why not, but I don't understand this hype, when it was basically already there.

That works for simple cases. Now, update a transitive dependency used by more than one dependency. You might get lucky and it'll just work.

Re: Uv is the best thing to happen to the Python ecosystem in a decade

#247

Post by hardwaregeek »

caconym_ wrote: post #227
hardwaregeek wrote: post #149

I gotta say, I feel pretty vindicated after hearing for years how Python’s tooling was just fine and you should just use virtualenv with pip and how JS must be worse, that when Python devs finally get a taste of npm/cargo/bundler in their ecosystem, they freaking love it. Because yes, npm has its issues but lock files and consistent installs are amazing

There is nothing I dread more within the general context of software development, broadly , than trying to run other people's Python projects. Nothing. It's shocking that it has been so bad for so long.

Never underestimate cultural momentum I guess. NBA players shot long 2 pointers for decades before people realized 3 > 2. Doctors refused to wash their hands before doing procedures. There’s so many things that seem obvious in retrospect but took a long time to become accepted

Re: Uv is the best thing to happen to the Python ecosystem in a decade

#248

Post by aurintex »

I can only agree. I'm not an python expert, but I always struggled when installing a new package and got the warning, that it could break the system packages, or when cloning an existing repo on a new installed system. Always wondered, why it became so "complicated" over the years.

Re: Uv is the best thing to happen to the Python ecosystem in a decade

#249

Post by ifwinterco »

mk89 wrote: post #239
hardwaregeek wrote: post #149

I gotta say, I feel pretty vindicated after hearing for years how Python’s tooling was just fine and you should just use virtualenv with pip and how JS must be worse, that when Python devs finally get a taste of npm/cargo/bundler in their ecosystem, they freaking love it. Because yes, npm has its issues but lock files and consistent installs are amazing

I have used pip freeze > requirements.txt pip install -r requirements.txt Way before "official" lockfile existed. Your requirements.txt becomes a lockfile, as long as you accept to not use ranges. Having this in a single tool etc why not, but I don't understand this hype, when it was basically already there.

It is indeed fairly simple to implement it, which is why it's so weird that it's never been implemented at a language level
Post reply on HN