Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Y Combinator files brief supporting Epic Games, says store fees stifle startups

macrumors.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

241–247 of 247 posts

Re: Y Combinator files brief supporting Epic Games, says store fees stifle startups

#241

Post by neilv »

kelnos wrote: post #87
neilv wrote: post #7

> “Y Combinator — and the larger venture capital community — have long been hesitant to back app-based businesses that were poor investments due to the Apple Tax,” This could be good, if it encourages people to re-learn the value of open standards, like Web is supposed to be, rather than helping to perpetuate the proprietary app stores. Also, I think it's noteworthy that, once a company gets customers locked into a p…

Seriously. If Apple put even half of the effort into open web standards that they've put into building their mobile SDKs and the App Store ecosystem, we'd have webapps that would be just as capable, performant, and secure as native apps can be. Though I'm sure then Apple would lock a lot of device access by websites behind a domain allowlist that you have to pay a bunch of money to get on.

When I was doing fancy things with HTML5 Offline, Apple seemed to be actively breaking even that (e.g., storage), like other browsers weren't. Sigh.

Re: Y Combinator files brief supporting Epic Games, says store fees stifle startups

#242

Post by arp242 »

bruce511 wrote: post #129
throwaway31131 wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We probably do need some kind of regulation in this space because for better or worse, and I think it’s worse, it’s hard to be a participant in modern society without a smart phone. (In my mind it would be something more akin to the communications act of 1934, but for apps to mandate a certain amount of “interoperability” across operating systems, whatever that may mean, but I digress) on the other hand, it wasn’t al…

I would argue that there was more than a duopoly. We had Windows Phone, WebOS, blackberry, Palm etc. The market voted and we're left with 2. Equally, pretty much no iPhone user (outside of tech circles) cares about the App Store monopoly for iPhone. The policy is well known, and hasn't changed in 15 years. Indeed many (not all) tech folk who complain about the App Store still went out and bought an iPhone. The raw tr…

Whatever may or may not have happened in the past is not especially relevant. Today it's essentially impossible to enter the market as you will need to develop a solid iOS or Android compatibility layer, because the best phone in the world is useless without software (apps) you want to run. This is also a major reason several of those platform you mentioned didn't work out by the way.

Sailfish OS does exactly that, but it has a number of limitations and added friction due to legal and technical reasons.

And choosing between two systems is really not much of a "choice". Right now there is a story on the front page about Android app requiring devs to validate their ID, even for side-loaded apps.

Re: Y Combinator files brief supporting Epic Games, says store fees stifle startups

#243

Post by _carbyau_ »

ryandrake wrote: post #48
johnecheck wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is an argument for gating the free-for-all behind a setting technical users can find, not demanding 30% of revenue if a dev would like access to apple users. The security aspect is real, but this is really about maximizing profits by monopolizing access to anyone with an iPhone.

When a normal user is highly motivated to install software, there is no such distinction from a "technical user". He wants to install AnimeWallpapersTotallyNotATrojan.app. The operating system disallows it. Then he just does a search for how to install AnimeWallpapersTotallyNotATrojan.app on iOS, and finds 20 tutorials walking him through the steps to ungate the install. You can make the expert mode dialog say "Click…

> When a normal user is highly motivated...

...they reap the consequences of their actions.

A warning lets a person know it is getting deeper. It is up to the person to realise if they are out of their depth.

If a person lacks the self reflection to realise their capabilities then they need a guardian. Children and the elderly routinely have this for other aspects of life. Why not a phone?

Why can't I delegate such authority to others when I become old and infirm?

Re: Y Combinator files brief supporting Epic Games, says store fees stifle startups

#244

Post by mrandish »

jjtheblunt wrote: post #239
mrandish wrote: post #232

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's unsurprising that the internal narrative focused on the plausible user, product and technical issues which happen to align with sustaining the multi-billion dollar monopoly. Senior leadership isn't going to say the 'quiet part' out loud in all-hands meetings. I also worked in a valley giant with a multi-billion dollar monopoly position being preserved in a similar way. But I was senior enough to see both sides -…

we evidently both had very senior positions, but i came away with the impression that parts of Apple might operate differently than inner sanctum hw engineering (obviously) , though what i mentioned wasn't from some pep talks, but rather from hard data. i think the last two sentences you wrote resonate, for sure, though!

> i came away with the impression that parts of Apple might operate differently than inner sanctum hw engineering

I agree and I'm not at all questioning what you experienced. I saw similar things. In the case of Apple, it makes sense the iPhone business would prioritize issues like battery life etc and that the App Store business would prioritize maximizing their multi-billion dollar monopoly revenue stream. Within each business unit they're going to make decisions and allocate resources based on maximizing the metrics their business is judged on.

Where it gets 'interesting' is when two major business units have priorities which directly conflict - like one BU achieving a major objective requires the other BU to not achieve one of their major objectives. When those conflicts are things which directly impact tens of millions or more in revenue and are also high-visibility issues, the conflict gets elevated to the CEO in a small group mtg with both EVPs where they assesses the trade-offs on each side. Ultimately, the CEO is going to pick a 'winner' based on the overall impact to company-wide revenue and the stock price. If the issue is preserving (or losing) the app store monopoly worth billions - we can guess which side is very likely going to win. And maximum motivated reasoning will be deployed to highlight the many reasons that outcome is correct. Many of those reasons will even be legitimate :-).

Re: Y Combinator files brief supporting Epic Games, says store fees stifle startups

#246

Post by ben_w »

tekkk wrote: post #225
ben_w wrote: post #156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Maybe grandpas and grandmas should get a different phone then, like a Doro They did, they got an iPhone. > my mother has been scammed by legitimate App Store apps that have charged extra-fees just because they could. Did it empty her bank balance by abusing the private NFC payment APIs that Apple are being ordered to open up? Did it cryptolock all her files? Did it activate the camera and mic to spy on her for blac…

I don't want to get into politics but dont you think it's funny when you can purchase assault rifles, made for killing people, yet we are so afraid of having the poor individuals in control of their own phones. Or farming equipment - the list seems to keep growing. It's just corporate propaganda that all hell would break loose, you could just offer installing baby mode at Apple physical store that can only be removed…

> I don't want to get into politics but dont you think it's funny when you can purchase assault rifles, made for killing people

I'm British by birth, living in Berlin. We definitely think Americans are a bit "funny", in the not-at-all-funny sense of the word, about guns.

> It's just corporate propaganda that all hell would break loose, you could just offer installing baby mode at Apple physical store that can only be removed at said places.

Thing is, with computers, we've had decades of watching malware infect, destroy, corrupt, ransom, and blackmail. It's still happening, even.

And we even have a way to get past "baby mode" restrictions: be a developer.

But guess what? Developers also face supply chain attacks, because malware is everywhere.

I do miss the olden days when I didn't need to care. A mac online in 2009 was worry-free.

Re: Y Combinator files brief supporting Epic Games, says store fees stifle startups

#247

Post by jjtheblunt »

mrandish wrote: post #244
jjtheblunt wrote: post #239

Earlier quoted context omitted.

we evidently both had very senior positions, but i came away with the impression that parts of Apple might operate differently than inner sanctum hw engineering (obviously) , though what i mentioned wasn't from some pep talks, but rather from hard data. i think the last two sentences you wrote resonate, for sure, though!

> i came away with the impression that parts of Apple might operate differently than inner sanctum hw engineering I agree and I'm not at all questioning what you experienced. I saw similar things. In the case of Apple, it makes sense the iPhone business would prioritize issues like battery life etc and that the App Store business would prioritize maximizing their multi-billion dollar monopoly revenue stream. Within e…

definitely agree
Post reply on HN