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Proton joins suit against Apple for practices that harm developers and consumers

proton.me

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Re: Proton joins suit against Apple for practices that harm developers and consumers

#241

Post by ls612 »

o11c wrote: post #99
andrewinardeer wrote: post #20

I'm not an Apple enthusiast—my rarely used iPad mini is my only Apple device—but let me play devil’s advocate. If a company invests billions in R&D to create hardware and its integrated software, shouldn’t it have the right to control who or what interacts with it? Why should I be forced to open up the carefully designed ecosystem I’ve built? If my pitch is premium, high-speed hardware and intuitive software so user-…

> If a company invests billions in R&D to create hardware and its integrated software, shouldn’t it have the right to control who or what interacts with it? Do you think the same about printer ink? Regardless, we need to look at the law - and interoperability has a long history of legal support. Patents protect the product itself, but allow interoperable products. Trade secrets product the product from theft but not…

There has been absolutely no legal precedent about those DMCA carve-outs and previous cases that could have rested on them (eg Nintendo vs Yuzu) shouldn’t leave anyone optimistic about their strength.

Re: Proton joins suit against Apple for practices that harm developers and consumers

#243

Post by bogtog »

andrewinardeer wrote: post #20

I'm not an Apple enthusiast—my rarely used iPad mini is my only Apple device—but let me play devil’s advocate. If a company invests billions in R&D to create hardware and its integrated software, shouldn’t it have the right to control who or what interacts with it? Why should I be forced to open up the carefully designed ecosystem I’ve built? If my pitch is premium, high-speed hardware and intuitive software so user-…

> If a company invests billions in R&D to create hardware and its integrated software, shouldn’t it have the right to control who or what interacts with it? Why should I be forced to open up the carefully designed ecosystem I’ve built?

Once a company becomes massive enough and displays properties of a monopoly, the rules of free commerce change

(that being said, I agree that Apple largely provides users with a high-quality product)

Re: Proton joins suit against Apple for practices that harm developers and consumers

#244

Post by eviks »

boris2293 wrote: post #215

Apple can do anything it wants with its software. Just as any person decides who comes into his house, a corporation decides on what terms others can use its software.

Can a person cut your leg off in his house as part of "terms of service"?

Re: Proton joins suit against Apple for practices that harm developers and consumers

#245

Post by polarbear67 »

boris2293 wrote: post #215

Apple can do anything it wants with its software. Just as any person decides who comes into his house, a corporation decides on what terms others can use its software.

If I buy it and fully own it, I should be able to do anything I want with it.

Re: Proton joins suit against Apple for practices that harm developers and consumers

#246

Post by danans »

INGSOCIALITE wrote: post #238
socalgal2 wrote: post #233

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There are other options out there. This isn't about the a consumer's right to buy a different phone. It's about a business's right to do business with customers without Apple in the middle. And it's specifically about Apple's monopoly power over those businesses. No government is going to accept that some company, Apple, gets that kind of control.

so then i should be able to use any ink in my printer then...

I routinely buy printer toner and ink from companies that are not my printer's manufacturer. Where did you get the idea that it isn't possible to do so?

Re: Proton joins suit against Apple for practices that harm developers and consumers

#247

Post by Disposal8433 »

boris2293 wrote: post #215

Apple can do anything it wants with its software. Just as any person decides who comes into his house, a corporation decides on what terms others can use its software.

The law disagrees with your opinion. And that's a good thing.

Re: Proton joins suit against Apple for practices that harm developers and consumers

#248

Post by sneak »

Workaccount2 wrote: post #191
BowBun wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I don't think any big tech company has ever done anything as evil and predatory Don't you think this is _maybe_ an overstatement? I was annoyed about this for years but reading your take is borderline satirical.

No, I don't think it's an understatement at all.... In the difficulty of non-iMessage compatibility, I have had people close to me say "Why don't you just get an iPhone?" with an incredulous tone. Perhaps tech companies have had more evil things happen on their platforms, that for whatever reason they were slow to react to. But "Why don't you just get an iPhone" was a precisely and meticulously engineered line, pure…

I remember many years ago when I realized this is what they were doing with iMessage. It’s really truly brilliant.

I went all in; for years I paid 100% to replace phones of friends or lovers who were still sending archaic SMS.

It’s the implicit camraderie between the speaker and listener in “A computer for the rest of us…”

Today, I don’t even have iMessage enabled on my disposable carrier number. It’s off off.

Re: Proton joins suit against Apple for practices that harm developers and consumers

#249

Post by boredatoms »

wredcoll wrote: post #226
BugsJustFindMe wrote: post #222

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There's no technological reason for app developers to be restricted from using other payment processors But there is a customer experience reason. As an iOS user, I very much appreciate that I can ask Apple to cancel some bullshit subscription that used to otherwise try to lock me in behind a labyrinth of added friction and timewasting. Not every problem is technological.

I'm not a fancy lawyer or some kind of top flight ceo but I feel like "being able to cancel subscriptions" doesn't require a 30% cut off the top for apple. Also, as a customer, presumably you could choose to use apple's store.

Some vital apps will stop using apple’s store entirely if they could, it’ll proliferate

Re: Proton joins suit against Apple for practices that harm developers and consumers

#250

Post by slater »

danans wrote: post #246
INGSOCIALITE wrote: post #238

Earlier quoted context omitted.

so then i should be able to use any ink in my printer then...

I routinely buy printer toner and ink from companies that are not my printer's manufacturer. Where did you get the idea that it isn't possible to do so?

> Where did you get the idea that it isn't possible to do so?

Not op, but the various "must use our genuine brand printer cartridges!" schemes that printer manufacturers have used over the past, oh, 2 decades might have something to do with it?

edit to clarify: I mean the cartridges with their own chips that HP et al. tried to make happen a while back

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