Earlier quoted context omitted.
Probably unrelated to the broader discussion, but I don't think the "skeptic vs pro-AI" distinction even makes that much sense. For example, I usually come off as being relatively skeptic within the HN crowd, but I'm actually pushing for more usage at work. This kind of "opinion arbitrage" is common with new technologies.
One recent post I read about improving the discourse (which I seem to have lost the link...) agrees, but in a different way: adding a "capable vs not" axis. that is, "I believe AI is good enough to replace humans, and I am pro" is different than "I believe AI is good enough to replace humans, and I am against" and while "I believe AI is not good enough to replace humans, and I am pro" is a weird position to take, "I…
Cloudlflare builds OAuth with Claude and publishes all the prompts
241–250 of 552 posts
Re: Cloudlflare builds OAuth with Claude and publishes all the prompts
#242On the one hand, I would expect LLMs to be able to crank out such code when prompted by skilled engineers who also understand prompting these tools correctly. OAuth isn’t new, has tons of working examples to steal as training data from public projects, and in a variety of existing languages to suit most use cases or needs. On the other hand, where I remain a skeptic is this constant banging-on that somehow this will…
It's said that much of research is data janitorial work, and from my experience that's not just limited to the machine learning space. Every research scientist wishes that they had an army of engineers to build bespoke tooling for their niche, so they could get back to trying ideas at the speed of thought rather than needing to spend a day writing utility functions for those tools and poring over tables to spot anoma…
Re: Cloudlflare builds OAuth with Claude and publishes all the prompts
#243Why are you so surprised an LLM could regurgitate one back? I wouldn’t celebrate this example as a noteworthy achievement…
Re: Cloudlflare builds OAuth with Claude and publishes all the prompts
#244Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Vibe-coding won't be a net creativity gain to a researcher affected by vibe-immigration-policy, vibe-grant-availability, and vibe-firings, for all of which the unpredictability is a punitive design goal. Quite literally this is what I’m trying to get at with my resistance to LLM adoption in the current environment. We’re not using it to do hard work, we’re throwing it everywhere in an intentional decision to dumb d…
This is one of the best comments about the current AI hype. The elite really don't see why the proletariat should be interested in, or enjoy the dignity of, actual skill and quality. Hence the enshitification of everything, and now AI promises to commoditize everything into slop. Sad because it is the very deoth of society that has birthe
All technology has the effect of concentrating wealth, and anyone who insists on using their two hands to fashion things when machines exist that can do it better will always be relegated to the "artisan" bin as time rolls on.
Re: Cloudlflare builds OAuth with Claude and publishes all the prompts
#245Earlier quoted context omitted.
>My brother for example built a thing with Microsoft copilot that helped automate more in his manufacturing facility (used to be paper). I have harped on this endlessly as a non-programmer working a non-tech job, with 7 "vibe-coded" programs now being used daily by people at my company. I am sorry, but the tech world is completely missing the forest for the trees here. LLM's are talked about purely as tools that were…
Yep, and it allows them to build POCs that they can pass to "real" devs in a way that was not possible before.
LLMs excel at writing software for one or a handful of users with a very narrow but very well defined use cases.
I don't need an LLM to write Excel.exe for keeping track of 20 employee's hours. A simple GUI on a SQLite database can easily do that.
Re: Cloudlflare builds OAuth with Claude and publishes all the prompts
#246Earlier quoted context omitted.
Can you link to any sources that support your claim?
Sure. Here's something I'd written on the subject that I'd left lying in my drafts folder for a month, but I've now published just for you :) https://www.snellman.net/blog/archive/2025-06-02-llms-are-ch... It has links to public sources on the pricing of both LLMs and search, and explains why the low inference prices can't be due the inference being subsidized. (And while there are other possible explanations, it inc…
It's worthwhile to note that https://github.com/deepseek-ai/open-infra-index/blob/main/20... shows cost vs. theoretical income. They don't show 80% gross margins and there's probably a reason they don't share their actual gross margin.
OpenAI is the easiest counterexample that proves inference is subsidized right now. They've taken $50B in investment; surpassed 400M WAUs (https://www.reuters.com/technology/artificial-intelligence/o...); lost $5B on $4B in revenue for 2024 (https://finance.yahoo.com/news/openai-thinks-revenue-more-tr...); and project they won't be cash-flow positive until 2029.
Prices would be significantly higher if OpenAI was priced for unit profitability right now.
As for the mega-conglomerates (Google, Meta, Microsoft), GenAI is a loss leader to build platform power. GenAI doesn't need to be unit profitable, it just needs to attract and retain people on their platform, ie you need a Google Cloud account to use Gemini API.
Re: Cloudlflare builds OAuth with Claude and publishes all the prompts
#247Oh hey, looks like it's mostly Kenton Varda, who you may recognize from his LAN party house: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42156977
Re: Cloudlflare builds OAuth with Claude and publishes all the prompts
#248It’s now a year+ old and models have advanced radically, but most of the key points still hold, which I've summarized here. The post has way more details if you need. Many of these points have also been echoed by others like @simonw.
Background:
* The main project is specialized and "researchy" enough that there is no direct reference on the Internet. The core idea has been explored in academic literature, a couple of relevant proprietary products exist, but nobody is doing it the way I am.
* It has the advantage of being greenfield, but the drawback of being highly “prototype-y”, so some gnarly, hacky code and a ton of exploratory / one-off programs.
* Caveat: my usage of AI is actually very limited compared to power users (not even on agents yet!), and the true potential is likely far greater than what I've described.
Highlights:
* At least 30% and maybe > 50% of the code is AI-generated. Not only are autocompletes frequent, I do a lot of "chat-oriented" and interactive "pair programming", so precise attribution is hard. It has written large, decently complicated chunks of code.
* It does boilerplate extremely easily, but it also handles novel use-cases very well.
* It can refactor existing code decently well, but probably because I'ver worked to keep my code highly modular and functional, which greatly limits what needs to be in the context (which I often manage manually.) Errors for even pretty complicated requests are rare, especially with newer models.
Thoughts:
* AI has let me be productive – and even innovate! – despite having limited prior background in the domains involved. The vast majority of all innovation comes from combining and applying well-known concepts in new ways. My workflow is basically a "try an approach -> analyze results -> synthesize new approach" loop, which generates a lot of such unique combinations, and the AI handles those just fine. As @kentonv says in the comments, there is no doubt in my mind that these models “understand” code, as opposed to being stochastic parrots. Arguments about what constitutes "reasoning" are essentially philosophical at this point.
* While the technical ideas so far have come from me, AI now shows the potential to be inventive by itself. In a recent conversation ChatGPT reasoned out a novel algorithm and code for an atypical, vaguely-defined problem. (I could find no reference to either the problem or the solution online.) Unfortunately, it didn't work too well :-) I suspect, however, that if I go full agentic by giving it full access to the underlying data and letting it iterate, it might actually refine its idea until it works. The main hurdles right now are logistics and cost.
* It took me months to become productive with AI, having to find a workflow AND code structure that works well for me. I don’t think enough people have put in the effort to find out what works for them, and so you get these polarized discussions online. I implore everyone, find a sufficiently interesting personal project and spend a few weekends coding with AI. You owe it to yourself, because 1) it's free and 2)...
* Jobs are absolutely going to be impacted. Mostly entry-level and junior ones, but maybe even mid-level ones. Without AI, I would have needed a team of 3+ (including a domain expert) to do this work in the same time. All knowledge jobs rely on a mountain of donkey work, and the donkey is going the way of the dodo. The future will require people who uplevel themselves to the state of the art and push the envelope using these tools.
* How we create AI-capable senior professionals without junior apprentices is going to be a critical question for many industries. My preliminary take is that motivated apprentices should voluntarily eschew all AI use until they achieve a reasonable level of proficiency.
Re: Cloudlflare builds OAuth with Claude and publishes all the prompts
#249Earlier quoted context omitted.
> But what if you only need 2 kentonv's instead of 20 at the end? Do you assume we'll find enough new tasks that will occupy the other 18? I think that's the question. This is likely where all this will end up. I have doubts that AI will replace all engineers, but I have no doubt in my mind that we'll certainly need a lot less engineers. A not so dissimilar thing happened in the sysadmin world (my career) when everyt…
I think there's a huge huge space of software to build that isn't being touched today because it's not cost-effective to have an engineer build them. But if the time it takes an engineer to build any one thing goes down, now there are a lot more things that are cost effective. Consider niche use cases. Every company tends to have custom processes and workflows. Think about being an accountant at one company vs. anoth…
Will AI be able translate all that into rust?
Re: Cloudlflare builds OAuth with Claude and publishes all the prompts
#250I'm the author of this library! Or uhhh... the AI prompter, I guess... I'm also the lead engineer and initial creator of the Cloudflare Workers platform. -------------- Plug: This library is used as part of the Workers MCP framework. MCP is a protocol that allows you to make APIs available directly to AI agents, so that you can ask the AI to do stuff and it'll call the APIs. If you want to build a remote MCP server,…