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US weighs Google break-up in landmark antitrust case

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Re: US weighs Google break-up in landmark antitrust case

#241
Considering how many great/successful products that Google killed because they weren't successful "enough" compared to the ad business, this would be a good thing.

Products like Reader, News, etc. would still be around if they'd been split off from the Google mothership.

Re: US weighs Google break-up in landmark antitrust case

#242

There's side effect benefit of big kahuna companies mainly on the significant breakthrough and game changing research output because these excellent researchers are paid handsome money compared to conventional universities or research institutions. We saw this with AT&T Bell research labs with their inventions of transistor and Unix, among others. The same thing happened with Google research with (arguably) deep lear…

So it's OK to burden the whole country with a monopoly as long as they fund a handful of Nobel prizes?

Competition is a prerequisite for healthy Capitalism. Lack of competition is the Achilles heel.

Re: US weighs Google break-up in landmark antitrust case

#243

The free market's great IF there's competition. If the market's dead, it's time to reinject some life and keep the cogs turning. Scale's great, but it often comes with a societal cost. For every efficiency made, there's less agency and decent jobs to go round. Seems unfair to make such decisions ad-hoc though, and string it out through years of court cases and m/billions of lawyer fees. Why not establish rules of the…

Sort of playing devil's advocate here, but well run companies with near monopolies have on many occasions provided massive benefits that would not have been possible at smaller scale.

Think of Bell Labs.

Google has a number of Bell Labs style projects ongoing that massively benefit scientific research. Transformers, AlphaFold, etc.

It's hard to see how a smaller, more focused company would be able to justify that type of R&D.

That said, I do see an issue where some of the smartest people get sucked up by big tech. Instead of working on fundamental advances in image processing they end up working on beauty filters for Instagram. That can't be right.

Re: US weighs Google break-up in landmark antitrust case

#244

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> nicely provide us with everything digitally that we could need... Advertising Sorry for the snark, but no one anywhere needs advertising. Advertising in it's current form is a plague on humanity.

Tons of small businesses rely on advertising. Tons of legit businesses only exist because online advertising became easy and widespread.

In general advertising is low ROI, the tradeoff being that it's "easy."

I think a lot of these businesses could succeed using alternative promotional strategies. Some of them might suffer because the owners have more money than time and advertising is a good tradeoff in that case, but overall good products are still going to do well.

Re: US weighs Google break-up in landmark antitrust case

#245

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> nicely provide us with everything digitally that we could need... Advertising Sorry for the snark, but no one anywhere needs advertising. Advertising in it's current form is a plague on humanity.

Tons of small businesses rely on advertising. Tons of legit businesses only exist because online advertising became easy and widespread.

If you rely on advertising you should not be outsourcing it to google anyway. You should have more control over that part of your business which means it needs to be at least partially in house. Even if you do take some google ads, make sure you have other partners and make sure that ads meet your standards (not a scam, not for your competitors).

Re: US weighs Google break-up in landmark antitrust case

#246

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> nicely provide us with everything digitally that we could need... Advertising Sorry for the snark, but no one anywhere needs advertising. Advertising in it's current form is a plague on humanity.

Tons of small businesses rely on advertising. Tons of legit businesses only exist because online advertising became easy and widespread.

"Many" feels like it is doing a lot of heavy lifting here.

IME this is only true about drop shippers and similar business models. The vast majority of small businesses are, as a rule, awful at advertising. The few ads I see they are very poorly put together.

Even when they manage to get people to the business, small businesses are almost inevitably awful about maintaining their web presence, which makes it moot. Here's an example thread about such from the local reddit. Including some hostile responses from, charitably, overwhelmed small businesses about how you need to call to confirm a price https://old.reddit.com/r/Calgary/comments/1ewlsib/open_lette...)

Re: US weighs Google break-up in landmark antitrust case

#247
post #175

My primary interest is how Alphabet will attempt to implement this. In particular, if they break up Search and Ads, or really any major product in google3/borg, Alphabet will have a massive pile of work splitting those up in a way that allows the resulting groups to achieve the same level of horizontal and vertical integration that they currently enjoy. Personally I am skeptical that they have enough technically capa…

Not sure that would be a bad thing.

Re: US weighs Google break-up in landmark antitrust case

#248

Loving the discourse in the comments here. Speaking as someone who grew up alongside Google in a sense, I fall on the side of the "break it up" camp. It was novel at the time to have a single company so nicely provide us with everything digitally that we could need - G Suite, YouTube, Search, Maps, Advertising, Books, Reader, etc - but in hindsight, we gave too much power to too unaccountable an entity, who in turn u…

Competition usually leads to higher wealth creation and GDP, not less.

If you use real life examples and history as a benchmark

Re: US weighs Google break-up in landmark antitrust case

#249

The free market's great IF there's competition. If the market's dead, it's time to reinject some life and keep the cogs turning. Scale's great, but it often comes with a societal cost. For every efficiency made, there's less agency and decent jobs to go round. Seems unfair to make such decisions ad-hoc though, and string it out through years of court cases and m/billions of lawyer fees. Why not establish rules of the…

> Scale's great

Is it? As consumers you may be noticing the impact now but as a developer I've felt the impact of Google's "scale" for years and it has not been pleasant.

Re: US weighs Google break-up in landmark antitrust case

#250

Hilarious to see all the people lamenting the break-up of AT&T. That break-up sparked the long distance phone race, which became the driving force for the massive laying of fiber optics... which enabled the Internet boom of the 1990s.

Breaking up AT&T was unquestionably the right call. (So to say.) Long distance was expensive for quite a while even after the break-up. If you called up an out-of-state friend or relative to catch up, you expected the call to cost you at least a few bucks. (And you hoped they would be the ones to call you next time.) Even into the 90's, long distance at $0.10/minute was considered cheap. And in most rural areas, ever…

This illustrates why breaking up google is a good idea given their egregious charges (free) for things people used to/still spend money on, such as:

- An office software suite

- Global maps and GPS, City Guides

- Video entertainment

- Mobile and Desktop OS

- Web Browsers

Also, pay no mind to their competitors in all of those markets AND in their core business of search, being feeble multi-trillion and multi-billion global corporations

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