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Dutch DPA fines Uber €290M because of transfers of drivers’ data to the US

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Re: Dutch DPA fines Uber €290M because of transfers of drivers’ data to the US

#241

Post by cube2222 »

qqcqq wrote: post #226

This puts the total fines from the EU on American tech businesses at $14.8B in the last few years: https://loeber.substack.com/p/20-no-more-eu-fines-for-big-te... I think this substack is good, it makes a pretty clear case that US tech companies may not leave Europe any time soon, but they wield the power in the relationship much more so than the Europeans. Those regulators are overplaying their hands.

How exactly are they overplaying their hand?

If, and that is a big if, American big tech decided to pull back from Europe, I wouldn’t be surprised if it ended up being a good thing for the local market in anything but the short term.

It’s very hard to compete with them (even in the local US market). Their disappearance from a market as big as the EU would likely spark competition.

Re: Dutch DPA fines Uber €290M because of transfers of drivers’ data to the US

#242

Post by mananaysiempre »

berikv wrote: post #229
qqcqq wrote: post #226

This puts the total fines from the EU on American tech businesses at $14.8B in the last few years: https://loeber.substack.com/p/20-no-more-eu-fines-for-big-te... I think this substack is good, it makes a pretty clear case that US tech companies may not leave Europe any time soon, but they wield the power in the relationship much more so than the Europeans. Those regulators are overplaying their hands.

The counterpoint to that article is: US Big Tech could also abide to EU laws and avoid fines altogether.

While the CLOUD Act exists, and in general while the US refuses to recognize privacy rights of foreigners and grant them sane due-process protections, it seems logically impossible to comply with US and EU legislation at the same time (the European Commission’s repeated but non-binding pronouncements to the contrary notwithstanding). That US companies aren’t exactly in a hurry to try looks to mostly be a distraction.

Re: Dutch DPA fines Uber €290M because of transfers of drivers’ data to the US

#243

Post by snowpid »

pembrook wrote: post #240
berikv wrote: post #229

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The counterpoint to that article is: US Big Tech could also abide to EU laws and avoid fines altogether.

US companies literally cannot abide by EU laws, because they are subject to US laws, which conflict with EU laws. This is what all these European judgements are disagreeing with. The companies are not at fault here. The governments are at fault for dropping the ball on coming to an agreement. We’re on like the 5th round of this. Compliance is impossible. Until the two governments fix this, US companies cannot operate…

The action by Uber was complettly avoidable.

Re: Dutch DPA fines Uber €290M because of transfers of drivers’ data to the US

#244

Post by nerdponx »

cube2222 wrote: post #241
qqcqq wrote: post #226

This puts the total fines from the EU on American tech businesses at $14.8B in the last few years: https://loeber.substack.com/p/20-no-more-eu-fines-for-big-te... I think this substack is good, it makes a pretty clear case that US tech companies may not leave Europe any time soon, but they wield the power in the relationship much more so than the Europeans. Those regulators are overplaying their hands.

How exactly are they overplaying their hand? If, and that is a big if, American big tech decided to pull back from Europe, I wouldn’t be surprised if it ended up being a good thing for the local market in anything but the short term. It’s very hard to compete with them (even in the local US market). Their disappearance from a market as big as the EU would likely spark competition.

They aren't overplaying their hand, or at least they aren't according to anything presented in that article. The author frets about some balance of power, but does not make a convincing case that the EU position is threatened in any way.

Less we also forget that US public sentiment is shifting. If anything, big tech needs to be careful.

Re: Dutch DPA fines Uber €290M because of transfers of drivers’ data to the US

#246

Post by j_maffe »

pembrook wrote: post #240
berikv wrote: post #229

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The counterpoint to that article is: US Big Tech could also abide to EU laws and avoid fines altogether.

US companies literally cannot abide by EU laws, because they are subject to US laws, which conflict with EU laws. This is what all these European judgements are disagreeing with. The companies are not at fault here. The governments are at fault for dropping the ball on coming to an agreement. We’re on like the 5th round of this. Compliance is impossible. Until the two governments fix this, US companies cannot operate…

Couldn't they have kept the data stored in the EU? What US law prevents that?

Re: Dutch DPA fines Uber €290M because of transfers of drivers’ data to the US

#247

Post by pyrale »

pembrook wrote: post #216
AlanYx wrote: post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The EC has issued an "adequacy decision" regarding the new EU–US Data Privacy Framework (the replacement for Privacy Shield): https://commission.europa.eu/document/fa09cbad-dd7d-4684-ae6... and has begun "certifying" compliance with the Framework: https://www.dataprivacyframework.gov/list So maybe the DPAs will defer to the EC's interpretation of adequacy under the GDPR for this new Framework? Lots of unknowns though…

Exactly, compliance is currently impossible since this is a geopolitical spat between the US and EU over US law. The goalposts on this move every 6 months, so the fines are easy money for the EU. The companies are just collateral damage. For some reason HN is full of people who don’t actually understand this issue but feel very emotionally passionate that all US tech companies are evil and doing this on purpose. “Jus…

> Lol. They would if there was a clear law/process to follow that didn’t get shot down every few months.

There isn't a process because US law makes it clear that US companies should be auxiliary to illegal acts abroad. And we find out every few months, that even when they aren't forced to, they disregard the law.

Sure, maybe they're not "evil", but they apparently can't find a way to be law-abiding entities.

Re: Dutch DPA fines Uber €290M because of transfers of drivers’ data to the US

#248

Post by benreesman »

qqcqq wrote: post #226

This puts the total fines from the EU on American tech businesses at $14.8B in the last few years: https://loeber.substack.com/p/20-no-more-eu-fines-for-big-te... I think this substack is good, it makes a pretty clear case that US tech companies may not leave Europe any time soon, but they wield the power in the relationship much more so than the Europeans. Those regulators are overplaying their hands.

Let’s get that number up! I want to see some CEOs opting for the E-Class vs the S-Class because they intentionally, willfully, knowingly treated citizens like plebeians.

You guys can get with the program now, or you can wait for one of those tent camps to abruptly rise up and drag you out of your Plaid Tesla and beat you to death with your own iPhone.

Re: Dutch DPA fines Uber €290M because of transfers of drivers’ data to the US

#250

Post by snowpid »

qqcqq wrote: post #226

This puts the total fines from the EU on American tech businesses at $14.8B in the last few years: https://loeber.substack.com/p/20-no-more-eu-fines-for-big-te... I think this substack is good, it makes a pretty clear case that US tech companies may not leave Europe any time soon, but they wield the power in the relationship much more so than the Europeans. Those regulators are overplaying their hands.

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