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Cousins are disappearing. Is this reshaping the experience of childhood?

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Re: Cousins are disappearing. Is this reshaping the experience of childhood?

#241

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm baffled my peers , who absolutely could afford to, still have no interest. These are people making 150-200k (and at my prior job, 200-400k).

I just don't have any interest in kids. They're expensive and they require a ton of sacrifice. I'd rather travel, golf, do hobbies and generally enjoy my life. The only people that seem to want me to have babies are my parents so they can have grand kids... too which I've told them "Thank you for having me, but that's not a valid reason for me to sacrifice my life". I don't really care about the preservation of the h…

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Re: Cousins are disappearing. Is this reshaping the experience of childhood?

#242

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In my area these houses are snatched up by real estate companies and turned into rentals within a week of closing.

Who is living in those rentals?

Young people paying a massive portion of their income (significantly larger than previous generations) just to have a roof, and gaining zero equity in the process. Hence "renting", as opposed to "owning".

Re: Cousins are disappearing. Is this reshaping the experience of childhood?

#243

Anecdata: I am 31 and have 3 young kids. They have 0 cousins and, on top of that, 0... second cousins? Cousins-once-removed? Whatever the one is for my cousin's kids. My kids are my grandma's only great-grandkids. And I have... 6 cousins. On top of that, at my last job, on my team of 15, I was the only one with kids, and only 1 of those 15 engineers were under the age of 30. At my current job, my team is 8, and again…

Anecdata from Germany checking in: I have 2 kindergarden aged kids. They have 13 cousins. I don't even know how many second cousins.

Re: Cousins are disappearing. Is this reshaping the experience of childhood?

#244

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Having children when you're rebuilding/are going to your potential death, is a very different circumstance. It's a lot easier to have kids when you have nothing left to lose. Indeed, such ignorance on HN these days.

> It's a lot easier to have kids when you have nothing left to lose. What does that even mean? I also don’t think “nothing left to lose” was really the attitude of the post-War world and (especially) the US.

You're a young male off to fight in either of the most brutal wars in history. This might just be the last time you see your wife, so you have nothing to lose in having a child at that point, as you have a much higher chance of never being able to do so later when things are better.

Alternatively you lived in a city reduced to ruins by the war, everything you knew or had is gone and you have no idea when or even if you'll be able to recover. Having a child doesn't involve as much of a concern over whether or not you can give them a better upbringing because things couldn't really get much worse in the first place.

Now, on the other hand, if you're talking about post-war, the world was recovering, there were opportunities everywhere, the future was looking more hopeful. You could just have kids and trust that they'd live a more comfortable life than yourself.

Nowadays, we're at this awkward point where there's just enough uncertainty and instability in the future, yet not bad enough that people have nothing to lose that people would rather wait or just not have any kids at all.

Re: Cousins are disappearing. Is this reshaping the experience of childhood?

#245
post #168
post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The most consistent predictor of the decline of the birth rate in a society is increased levels of wealth, which indicates it's in no way that simple. Personally, I think it is that expectations rise, both for your own life and for that of children once your purchasing power increases. It's harder to give it up than to not have it in the first place. Having children increasingly has to compete with a lot of other rew…

Having children has also become higher risk, both in absolute costs - as well as risks associated to the likely possibility of divorce and single-parenthood.

It had plenty of risks before too. Doing genealogy, e.g. of one of my great-great grandfather's children, several died young and left behind children, some ran away from responsibilities (one child - my grandmothers first cousin - ended up in care and was adopted because her mother was too poor to care for her and her dad ran off to the US with his brothers, and we didn't learn she existed until a few years after she'd died) or were forced to work abroad for years at a time. Of 12 or so of his children, I think only 4 were in their children's life until they reached adulthood, and at least one of them was a single parent because her husband died young.

The same great-great grandfathers second wife likewise "lost" a brother that was almost certainly taken into care while she and her older brother were left to fend for themselves as teenagers after being orphaned when their father died after having cared for them alone for a few years after their mother died.

My grandmother's mother - married to one of the children of the same great-great grandparents - lost contact with her siblings in her early teens when they were all taken into care when her dad proved unable to deal following her mother's death. While she found a couple of her sisters again later, her dads failure to cope means even now we've not been able to figure out what happened to the rest of her siblings.

While divorce is more common, abandonment, be it intentional due to the difficulty of obtaining a divorce, or unintentional (poverty, disease, death), or absence for noble reasons (e.g. going off to earn money to support the family) still left a lot of people raising children on their own in often awful conditions.

There's a marked increase in the number of situations like that for each generation further back in my family tree among the people I can track.

Re: Cousins are disappearing. Is this reshaping the experience of childhood?

#246

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I just don't have any interest in kids. They're expensive and they require a ton of sacrifice. I'd rather travel, golf, do hobbies and generally enjoy my life. The only people that seem to want me to have babies are my parents so they can have grand kids... too which I've told them "Thank you for having me, but that's not a valid reason for me to sacrifice my life". I don't really care about the preservation of the h…

You’re benefiting from other people’s sacrifice. Your end of life care is entirely dependent on other people having and raising functional children. And these are all pretty weak reasons — people with kids do all of the things you’ve mentioned.

If they work for money and use it to pay the children to care for them, what difference does it make if they also have kids or not? Why would your kids have to be the ones to care for you for it to “even out”? In that argument, is daycare banned because the child is not cared for by the parents of the child? What if one of the parents dies? Is it ok to pay for help then?

Re: Cousins are disappearing. Is this reshaping the experience of childhood?

#247

You're baffled people aren't having kids? What bubble do you live in? People straight up can't afford housing much less children. The avg American is completely priced out of owning a home right now. Edit: the replies - y'all are out of touch. Visit an average family in the Midwest with a household income of < $100k/yr that doesn't own a home yet.

Humans had plenty of children in much worse times. People are not having kids for other reasons: Convenience, infertility, wealth, etc

Re: Cousins are disappearing. Is this reshaping the experience of childhood?

#248
post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How did your daughter only end up with 1 cousin from your 11 siblings? That's a catastrophically low TFR.

I could be 1 in the same age range.

my dad was the youngest of 7. and he had kids late. so almost all my cousins on my dads side are at least a decade older than me, and we barely had any contact with them growing up. on the other hand, cousins on my mothers side are all my age, and i have the best relationship with at least one of them despite only seeing each other every few years.

Re: Cousins are disappearing. Is this reshaping the experience of childhood?

#249

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Have you noticed that much, much poorer places often have a much higher birth rate? I think there is something else going on. And I mean poorer in terms of actual living conditions on the ground.

When you're poorer, especially in countries with less well enforced legal systems, you're not as negatively affected by having more children. Your priority is simply being able to stay fed and taking what work you can get, not buying a home in an area conducive to your highly specialized career. More kids are just another mouth to feed until they become capable of contributing to the family finances (typically at muc…

This. In poorer parts of the world, you might have an extra mouth to feed for the first 15-20 years, but once your child finishes school and finds work they're contributing to your well-being and to helping feed the younger children. You also need not worry too much about your retirement, because you know your family will support you, and you'll play a role raising your grandchildren and great grandchildren.

Re: Cousins are disappearing. Is this reshaping the experience of childhood?

#250
post #224

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're misconstruing what census.gov says. If you look into the "definitions" section it defines "Housing Unit. A housing unit is a house, an apartment, a group of rooms, or a single room occupied or intended for occupancy as separate living quarters." and "Householder. The householder refers to the person (or one of the persons) in whose name the housing unit is owned or rented [...]" 49% of people aged 30-34 aren't…

No, I'm not. I'm citing the numbers in the table entitled "Quarterly Homeownership Rates for the U.S. and Regions: 1964 to Present"* (emphasis added). That table is talking about homeownership rates, not householdership rates, and the definition they give is this: > Homeownership Rates. The proportion of households that are owners is termed the homeownership rate. It is computed by dividing the number of households t…

That table doesn't break things down by age.

Just own it dude. You pulled the "49% of people aged 30-34" thing from this chart https://www.census.gov/housing/hvs/files/qtr423/tab7.xlsx or some variation of it and you misunderstood it.

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