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How to learn chess as an adult (2021)

alexcrompton.com

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Re: How to learn chess as an adult (2021)

#241
post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’ve known this guy off and on for years. When we first met 15+ years he was slightly better at Go than me, which was middling amateur. All the Go books say if you want to be a pro you have to start as a child. But he studied, and studied, and last I knew he was 3 dan, which is about the point you can entertain the idea of becoming a pro (if I just worked harder). Kids have a lot more free time to sink into a singula…

You're right I think. Most adults really don't improve at chess very often. They do when it's a new hobby, but then they plateau. And it's not that they couldn't improve further, it's just that they're not able or willing to do the things necessary, which is usually a lot of exercise and study. It's just a hobby for most people at the end of the day, and they'd rather spend an hour at the club discussing and blitzing…

It clearly aggravated some of the people at the Go club that I was not improving past hobbyist. But the thing I didn’t share with them is that all through my childhood, I would try new things and if I wasn’t instantly mediocre or better at it I would decide this was no fun and drop it. If you are good at enough things you can fill your weeks with activities and ignore the things you aren’t good at.

Being bad at Go and still playing anyway was an exercise in personal growth.

Re: How to learn chess as an adult (2021)

#242
post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’ve known this guy off and on for years. When we first met 15+ years he was slightly better at Go than me, which was middling amateur. All the Go books say if you want to be a pro you have to start as a child. But he studied, and studied, and last I knew he was 3 dan, which is about the point you can entertain the idea of becoming a pro (if I just worked harder). Kids have a lot more free time to sink into a singula…

> but there are people who can blow right past them Ultimately, I think this is what's often downplayed in these conversations. Just because your friend was able to excel at Go in those 15 years, doesn't imply that any other specific person would be able to do the same, even with the same study. You'll find many people who attempted this but simply couldn't get past a lower plateau. So, when you say "if you can make…

I’ve known too many people who get into their own heads about certain topics. They lock up and become impervious to new information.

There are certainly people who need new genes. And there are people who need a new teacher. But boy oh boy are there a lot of people who would get better at difficult tasks if they got therapy.

Re: How to learn chess as an adult (2021)

#243
>Especially at lower levels, chess is a game of short term patterns, not long term strategy.

That’s actually wrong. Short-term patterns will improve your chess short-term but you’ll hit the plateau pretty fast. They don’t teach you to play better at chess. It’s like copypasting some code from the Internet without fully understanding how it works.

In chess, it’s absolutely necessary to have a long-term plan: especially at lower levels, your ultimate goal should be attacking the king most of the time.

Use the engine smartly. Because it will tell you what move is objectively the best. It won’t tell you what move is best at your level. At different levels the best moves are different.

It’s important to train tactics but not with puzzles. Puzzles model situations that are out of context. It’s like training your swimming movements without hitting the water. It may be not harmful, but not particularly useful. Instead, you should get “puzzles” in your live games within the context, seeing the bigger picture.

Of course, you should play games. How can you expect to get better at playing chess without actually playing chess? Moreover, playing games and getting feedback on them should be the bulk of your training. Learning happens by trial and error.

Without dissecting this article any further, there is a battle-tested approach on how to get better at chess at any level and age:

- Be a kid. Don't overthink it. It's just a game after all. Feel it.

- Play as many games as possible. You can quickly get enough volume with bullet and blitz.

- Get feedback. You're able to give yourself decent feedback most of the time. Quickly analyze your games yourself or check them with someone, who can tell you what mistakes you have made at your level. Only afterward compare your thoughts to engine suggestions. Pay attention to the moves that drop the evaluation by more than (1, 2, 3, 4) points, depending on your level.

Of course, these are not hard and fast rules. But this is a solid foundation for the success.

P.S. My FIDE rating is 2423.

Re: How to learn chess as an adult (2021)

#244
post #184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I play competitive games in tournaments. I would disagree with your characterization. Yes, people have a skill ceiling. However, it’s not something you’re ever going to get to by just playing most games. People naturally improve at games when they start playing. Some factors being more familiarity with the game, and making less mistakes. However, people will stall out at different ratings at that point. However, if y…

> However, if you do deliberate practice in the game you will absolutely continue to get better I strongly disagree. I think that, for a given amount of effort (hours and study intensity) you’re willing to spend, everybody has a ceiling that they can reach. If what you say is true, why hasn’t Magnus Carlsen reached ELO 2900? Lack of deliberate practice? ELO deflation requiring players to get better to keep the same r…

>I think that, for a given amount of effort (hours and study intensity) you’re willing to spend, everybody has a ceiling that they can reach.

I disagree with your disagreement, because simply controlling for total studying time and intensity is too reductionist. Different players have different sticking points when it comes to chess, e.g. weak strategic planning, weak tactics, poor positional understanding, bad endgames, etc. Your implicit assumption is that most players at some playing strength, are at that playing strength in all aspects of their game. In practice, that's simply not the case for many.

To give a concrete example, my classical rating on lichess hovers around 1800, but if you look at my tactics puzzle rating it's well above 2000, suggesting it's the positional and strategic aspects of the game that I'm weak at, which anecdotally feels true based on how I both win and lose most of my games. If I were to get a coach or deliberately work on those weaker aspects of my game myself (something I have not done), so that they're no longer the bottleneck of my performance, I could very well break this rating plateau I've been stuck in for the past half decade or so, and shoot up another 100 or even 200 points. I also have a friend of similar strength level, who has the opposite profile as me: strong positional and strategic understanding, weak tactics. And despite more or less an even record, whenever we play against each other, his wins are almost always grinds, while my wins are usually some tactical shot he missed or blundered into.

The bottom line is, at my strength level, and I'd hypothesize even up to the low to mid-2000s rating levels, these unbalanced types of players are probably more common than balanced players with similar ratings in all aspects of their game to their overall rating. The latter kind, you might be able to argue, have reached their natural ceiling; but even here I'd be surprised if they cannot improve more by deliberately strengthening aspects of their game. Conversely, based on my experience of 10+ years playing chess regularly, the vast majority of players simply don't have a good understanding of their own weaknesses. Many unbalanced players like myself, with the correct type of training and practice, even if total time isn't too much, can absolutely make significant improvements to their overall performance.

>If what you say is true, why hasn’t Magnus Carlsen reached ELO 2900? Lack of deliberate practice? ELO deflation requiring players to get better to keep the same rating?

In the case of top-level IMs, GMs, and certainly super GMs, who don't have glaring weaknesses in any aspects of their game, it's likely the case that they indeed did reach their ceiling. But these are the only people I'd be at all confident in making such claims.

Re: How to learn chess as an adult (2021)

#246

>Especially at lower levels, chess is a game of short term patterns, not long term strategy. That’s actually wrong. Short-term patterns will improve your chess short-term but you’ll hit the plateau pretty fast. They don’t teach you to play better at chess. It’s like copypasting some code from the Internet without fully understanding how it works. In chess, it’s absolutely necessary to have a long-term plan: especiall…

> That’s actually wrong. Short-term patterns will improve your chess short-term but you’ll hit the plateau pretty fast

What you wrote, is exactly in-line with what the OT said: "Especially at lower levels, chess is a game of short term patterns, not long term strategy."

You are beginner, you need some opening, some little patterns to move out from the beginner level, and then you reach a new plateau, but you understand the basic, you have your "first stripe white belt" game and from there you should search for sure a way to move to the next plateau.

Re: How to learn chess as an adult (2021)

#247
post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh, just interesting to see a reference to Gwern, whom I'm only familiar with through postings on HN, in a blog post that's on HN.

This is also on HN. Same bubble, not much of a coincidence?

I wouldn't have been surprised to see him referenced in a comment. I was surprised to see it in a blog post that ended up here, where the blogger didn't reference HN in any way — it was all about chess (which is not one of the more common things discussed on HN).

Re: How to learn chess as an adult (2021)

#248

>Especially at lower levels, chess is a game of short term patterns, not long term strategy. That’s actually wrong. Short-term patterns will improve your chess short-term but you’ll hit the plateau pretty fast. They don’t teach you to play better at chess. It’s like copypasting some code from the Internet without fully understanding how it works. In chess, it’s absolutely necessary to have a long-term plan: especiall…

> That’s actually wrong. Short-term patterns will improve your chess short-term but you’ll hit the plateau pretty fast What you wrote, is exactly in-line with what the OT said: "Especially at lower levels, chess is a game of short term patterns, not long term strategy." You are beginner, you need some opening, some little patterns to move out from the beginner level, and then you reach a new plateau, but you understa…

Not having a long-term plan and focusing on short-term patterns is fundamentally wrong. You won't only hit the plateau but will be stuck there unless you relearn chess the right bias-free way.

Re: How to learn chess as an adult (2021)

#249
post #81

I don't like losing, I want to always win. That's why I don't play. I've been thinking recently that I should play anyway so that I could grow out of this condition. Any tips for that?

> I don't like losing, I want to always win. That's why I don't play.

Successful people fail often. Failures fail only once.

If you want success, make failure part of your DNA.

Re: How to learn chess as an adult (2021)

#250

>Especially at lower levels, chess is a game of short term patterns, not long term strategy. That’s actually wrong. Short-term patterns will improve your chess short-term but you’ll hit the plateau pretty fast. They don’t teach you to play better at chess. It’s like copypasting some code from the Internet without fully understanding how it works. In chess, it’s absolutely necessary to have a long-term plan: especiall…

Fixed formatting of the last part:

> - Be a kid. Don't overthink it. It's just a game after all. Feel it.

> - Play as many games as possible. You can quickly get enough volume with bullet and blitz.

> - Get feedback. You're able to give yourself decent feedback most of the time. Quickly analyze your games yourself or check them with someone, who can tell you what mistakes you have made at your level. Only afterward compare your thoughts to engine suggestions. Pay attention to the moves that drop the evaluation by more than (1, 2, 3, 4) points, depending on your level.

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