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Krita AI Diffusion

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Re: Krita AI Diffusion

#241

Post by dthul »

dotnet00 wrote: post #211
dthul wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> which you would know if you ever tried to draw anything I know exactly how hard it is to draw anything because I tried a bunch of times, and failed. I for one am happy that I can now express my creative ideas, which I couldn't do before due to missing talent / practice.

You're free to personally be happy that you can express your creative ideas, but it is a bit absurd to expect people who did put in the effort in practicing to not see you in a negative light as someone who wants the 'benefits' without putting in the hard work of self-improvement. This is a uniquely AI related issue, as artists of all mediums can relate with each other about their struggles learning and improving the…

That's trying to put words in my mouth. We were talking about creative expression being taken away by AI, and I argued that artists can still retain creative expression, and that these AI tools make it possible for more people to express themselves creatively. I never said that artists should have no reason to feel unhappy about that. That's criticising a position I didn't argue.

Re: Krita AI Diffusion

#242

Post by sussmannbaka »

elcomet wrote: post #156
southerntofu wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> "As far as I know there's a sizeable number of devs who don't intend to ever rely on copilot" I'm one of those. I've been programming for a while now and there's no way i'm gonna trust a neural network with my code. Debugging is painful enough without having to deal with subtle bugs hallucinated by ML. Some machines are really useful to reduce human suffering and augment our collective capabilities. Some machines a…

It seems like you tried used copilot did you? To me the best thing about it is not the full function generation, which doesn't work very reliably, it's to finish the end of the line, when you already know what you will type, and it just types it for you faster. It feels like magic and checking the code is extrême fast as it's just one line, much faster than writing it.

So it’s "just" providing the vim advantage to typing speed? As a vim user myself, I’d like to point to the tired argument that typing takes up the least amount of time yadda yadda

Re: Krita AI Diffusion

#243

Post by lionkor »

philote wrote: post #144
lionkor wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, that's a thing, I'm one of those people. While impressive, the two issues I have with codepilot and other AI tools are: 1. The code is usually the same code I'd get a few web searches away, except then it would have the appropriate copyright. As a FOSS developer (in my free time), I do not want to risk using code I don't have a license for, and thus dirtying up my entire project and putting it in danger of being…

3. To be truly useful, you have to send your company's proprietary code to a 3rd-party AI, which may or may not use it for training their AI, or which may or may not have security issues and leak your proprietary code. Yes, we do this already with GitHub/GitLab, etc. but those are mature and (AFAIK) haven't had big security issues like OpenAI has had in the past year. 4. For ChatGPT at least, you have to give them yo…

GitHub and GitLab are sufficiently useful, AI is not (for me)

Re: Krita AI Diffusion

#244

Post by vouaobrasil »

dragonwriter wrote: post #225
vouaobrasil wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is absolutely ridiculous and short-sighted. AI is a tool that is and always will make the creation of art less a matter of the expression of the human soul. What techies NEVER understand about art is this: that art is not just the end product for the artist but something they use to express THEMSELVES. UNLIKE other tools, AI makes creative decisions. No other tool has done this, and moreover, its primary purpose…

> UNLIKE other tools, AI makes creative decisions No, it doesn’t. That's just an anthropomorphization of “produces deterministic results of its inputs that are practically intractable to compute by other means”. But Stable Diffusion doesn’t “make creative decisions” any more than POV-Ray or (pre-Generative fill) Photoshop.

I agree, but I'll be more precise: AI may not make creative decisions, but it generates something that approximates a creative decision to a sufficient level that people are willing to use it as a replacement for real creative decision.

There. My argument works without modification but with this more precise definition.

Re: Krita AI Diffusion

#245

Post by bheadmaster »

radlad wrote: post #216
bheadmaster wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Is that really a thing? Yes. I'm a Vim user with 100 WPM typing speed, and I can say with confidence that Copilot isn't that useful to me. Typing boilerplate is not an issue - understanding what I wrote is most of the work. And having an AI spew code that I have to read is more work for me than just writing it myself.

Just as a data point counter to yours, I'm a Vim user with a 150+ wpm typing speed, and I have to say I find Copilot massively useful. In Go, it's great for dealing with a lot of the repetitive code one finds themselves writing. When writing Android apps, it's useful for API discovery!

The initial question was "Is there really a sizeable number of devs who don't intend to ever rely on Copilot?", not "Are all Vim users who type fast anti-Copilot?".

I don't mean to dismiss your data point, just to put things in context. Since Copilot is generally recognized as a useful tool, there will of course be Vim users with great typing speed who still find it useful regardless.

Now, when it comes to Go, I find that there isn't much repetitive code to write (especially since generics landed in Go 1.18). Some people say that error handling is repetitive, but I find that those people just bubble up errors without adding appropriate context, which makes them less useful. But I haven't personally found a scenario in which I explicitly thought "damn, I know exactly what I need to write, but it's so long - I wish someone would write it for me".

Re: Krita AI Diffusion

#246

Post by [deleted] »

OOPMan wrote: post #233
radlad wrote: post #216

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just as a data point counter to yours, I'm a Vim user with a 150+ wpm typing speed, and I have to say I find Copilot massively useful. In Go, it's great for dealing with a lot of the repetitive code one finds themselves writing. When writing Android apps, it's useful for API discovery!

Are you guys seriously involved in a WPM pissing contest?

[deleted]

Re: Krita AI Diffusion

#247

Post by bheadmaster »

OOPMan wrote: post #233
radlad wrote: post #216

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just as a data point counter to yours, I'm a Vim user with a 150+ wpm typing speed, and I have to say I find Copilot massively useful. In Go, it's great for dealing with a lot of the repetitive code one finds themselves writing. When writing Android apps, it's useful for API discovery!

Are you guys seriously involved in a WPM pissing contest?

Do you know how many hours I've spent grinding gtypist? Of course I'm going to involve myself in WPM pissing contests.

Not doing so would be like going to the gym and not posting your muscle flexing photos on social media. It's just taking away the joy.

Re: Krita AI Diffusion

#248

Post by ouraf »

hafriedlander wrote: post #8

Somewhat tangential, but the Krita community and core team have been pretty explicitly anti-AI. https://krita-artists.org/t/change-in-policy-for-topics-rela... (I am part of a group that builds UI on top of open models, but we stopped working on our Krita version for that reason.)

A tool is a tool. If the krita team is anti AI, they can choose to just ignore a plug-in or extension made by an independent team.

Do your thing.

Re: Krita AI Diffusion

#249

Post by [deleted] »

ajuc wrote: post #235
dotnet00 wrote: post #214

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Have you ever actually looked into people who do that? They put in a lot of effort into understanding the original creator, their intent, process, materials etc. The copies are still very much art as they are expressions of the imitator's feelings towards the work. Performing studies of popular art by trying to replicate it is a powerful tool for learning precisely because it allows you, as an artist, to understand h…

> AI is none of that. How do we know? We can do art Turing Test - have 3 real artists and an text/image generation AI train on somebody's art. Have it generate the images and answer questions about the art. If you can't tell which one of them is AI - would you conceed they are "all of that"?

[deleted]

Re: Krita AI Diffusion

#250

Post by voitvoder »

opyate wrote: post #209
thot_experiment wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The AI hate is suuuch a meme in the art community, it's very frustrating/alienating. (Though understandably, neoliberal capitalism is also extremely frustrating, so I see why artists mad, I just wish they'd be mad at the root cause.) ((the root cause is that an economic system fundamentally based on scarcity == value doesn't make sense when applied to things that are essentially infinite, and kludgeing in artificial…

I don't get AI hate. It's nothing other than "technology hate". As a web developer who started out in 2001/2002, I watched as custom web design jobs dried up, and more and more people (and ahem artists) started using online tools to create a templatised website on the cheap. Did I throw a tantrum? Nope! I learned to do backend dev so I could make my own automation tools. Seriously, just embrace these new superpowers…

They are only superpowers until you have made enough AI art to see how pathetically limited and un-creative midjourney is.

This is all a lot of nothing. A year ago at this time I thought we had reached the art singularity. Now after thousands of images, seeing any AI art makes me want to puke. It is just the same shit over and over and over because it is so limited in what it can actually make.

In the long run all AI art will do is make people appreciate human art more. Any human artist against AI art is an idiot.

It is not like web design or anything else. AI Art is a giant decentralized PR and unintentional advertising campaign that will show how awesome human artists are and how overhyped AI is.

In a few years people will view AI art as useless, shit, scriblings of non-artists. Why? Because that is exactly what it is.

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