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Outlook now ignores Windows' Default Browser and opens links in Edge by default

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Re: Outlook now ignores Windows' Default Browser and opens links in Edge by default

#241

Post by whstl »

hospitalJail wrote: post #86
Analemma_ wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> That is on iOS, on MacOS they allow other browsers and respect the systemwide defaults. Why is that in any way exonerating? Most people do most of their actual computing on their phones now, it is not an irrelevant toy platform. We should be more, not less, hard on Apple than Microsoft for pulling this shit on their mobile platform.

Apple sells the ability to be part of an 'in-group'. People don't buy their phones for their computing abilities, they do it to have access to other Apple users. Its a psychology trick that took decades of marketing to pull off, but they are deeply entrenched as someone's identity. These users have a religious devotion and will defend them, because an attack on Apple is an attack on them and their group. If you don't…

This only applies to the US, if anything.

I don't think I ever used iMessage or Facetime in my life and I've been using iPhones for 15 years. Most people I know that have an iPhone also don't care, in the 3 countries I lived in. We use WhatsApp, Signal or Telegram.

Re: Outlook now ignores Windows' Default Browser and opens links in Edge by default

#242

Post by hutzlibu »

aerzen wrote: post #189
ho_schi wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Dear European-Union! How about enforcing direct control about Microsoft business? Not just another “low” fine in the ten to twenty billion range. Just stopping Microsoft, Apple, Google, Facebook and Amazon. Enforcing AT&T to not enter any new business worked well. In consequence we got UNIX, C, open-source and documentation and finally the TCP/IP-stack of BSD, GNU and Linux. This had a positive effect for the complet…

Hmmm, interesting. How would this be implemented in practice? EU passing laws about specific things that Microsoft should and shouldn't do?

EU can only implement laws regarding companies doing buisness in europe.

EU cannot tell Microsoft in general what to do.

Re: Outlook now ignores Windows' Default Browser and opens links in Edge by default

#243

Post by deely3 »

TX81Z wrote: post #155
13of40 wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A non-dark-pattern for that would be a button on the first suggestion that lets you disable the suggestion permanently.

I think people have started using “dark pattern” to mean any UX decisions they disagree with. There is a hugely substantive difference between this feature being on by default and say, making a ”reject tracking” button in 2 point grey font. Dark patterns are primarily things that if presented equally would result in a different decision which often go directly against the users self interest. I don’t see that here.

Some feature that appears from nowhere, enabled by default, changes you workflow to draw you attention to ecosystem owner. Feature that you have to do a search to disable it.

Not a dark pattern.

But when this happens 6 times in a row..

Re: Outlook now ignores Windows' Default Browser and opens links in Edge by default

#244

Post by haolez »

I'm currently using Linux due to this kind of hostile behavior from Microsoft on Windows.

However, we are power users and the big masses won't care about an ever increasing misalignment between the users' needs and Microsoft's. We cannot vote with our wallets, e.g. by using Linux instead. It won't matter.

What we could maybe do is contribute to projects like ReactOS[0] and make it easier for the layperson to migrate to it if modern Windows finally annoys them. Just food for thought.

[0] https://reactos.org/

Re: Outlook now ignores Windows' Default Browser and opens links in Edge by default

#245

Post by acdha »

hospitalJail wrote: post #140
splendor_spoon wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is such a funny take I see so often parroted by the self proclaimed ‘out-crowd’. Your need to feel different and therefore superior clouds your judgment. Some users like iPhones since they are reliable and consistent, exactly like a phone should be.

>Some users like iPhones since they are reliable and consistent, exactly like a phone should be. That is just the bare minimum. Its 2023, every phone is like this. Anyway, any teenager can tell you what its like to have the wrong kind of bubbles. They are extremely susceptible to in-group bias. Heck I wore Abercrombie and American Eagle, it wasn't because the clothes fit. I even had a single buddy, age 30, recently g…

> I even had a single buddy, age 30, recently get peer pressured into getting an iphone because his sister said "I don't date green bubbles". He took it to heart.

Shallow people are shallow, and it’s hardly like Apple made them that way. People do the same thing about cars, shoes, clothing, alcohol, zip codes, etc. The only upside is that it lets you very quickly identify and avoid them.

In the messaging case, it’s important to remember that Google is currently funding a huge lobbying campaign trying to get governments to restore the market position they gave up a decade ago. SMS messages have been green on iOS since the first iPhone – and shortly after the App Store launched most people were using Google Chat since everyone using Gmail was on it and it even federated with other XMPP services. Google spent the next decade pushing users away with a bunch of poorly conceived and executed attempts to lock users into their proprietary system. Only after those failed did they start picking up RCS, but most of their catch up with iMessage work has been proprietary extensions which help sell carriers on Google’s Jibe cloud service.

I like the idea of open protocols but Google is acting out of self interest and I have no doubt that they’d try to lock things up in a heartbeat if they think they could get away with it.

Let them park for their own PR, and we can talk about more open alternatives.

Re: Outlook now ignores Windows' Default Browser and opens links in Edge by default

#246

Post by bacchusracine »

splendor_spoon wrote: post #113
hospitalJail wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple sells the ability to be part of an 'in-group'. People don't buy their phones for their computing abilities, they do it to have access to other Apple users. Its a psychology trick that took decades of marketing to pull off, but they are deeply entrenched as someone's identity. These users have a religious devotion and will defend them, because an attack on Apple is an attack on them and their group. If you don't…

This is such a funny take I see so often parroted by the self proclaimed ‘out-crowd’. Your need to feel different and therefore superior clouds your judgment. Some users like iPhones since they are reliable and consistent, exactly like a phone should be.

>This is such a funny take I see so often parroted by the self proclaimed ‘out-crowd’. Your need to feel different and therefore superior clouds your judgment.

This is such a funny take I see so often parroted by the self proclaimed ‘out-crowd’. Your need to feel different and therefore superior clouds your judgment. Likes this post.

Yeah, there isn't anything going on beside out-group cope. Really glad most plans have unlimited text these days. Having spam texts where the person I'm communicating with just parrots what I'd just typed with the words "Liked this" would have driven me insane back in the days when you only got a thousand texts for the month.

Re: Outlook now ignores Windows' Default Browser and opens links in Edge by default

#247

Post by globular-toast »

userbinator wrote: post #10

Microsoft is always striving to improve and streamline our product experiences—offering a new way to use the classic Microsoft Outlook app on Windows and the Microsoft Edge web browser. to help you stay engaged in conversations as you browse the web. I wonder if the people who write this sort of BS-filled prose really believe in what they're writing. To be completely honest, the style almost sounds like LLM output.

They believe what they're writing will please the people that pay them.

Re: Outlook now ignores Windows' Default Browser and opens links in Edge by default

#248

Post by tredre3 »

hospitalJail wrote: post #79
wongarsu wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Google has an equally annoying crusade against anything that isn't Chrome. Visit google.com with Edge (on desktop) and you immediately get a popup on the top right "Google recommends using Chrome. Built for Windows. Easily search on Google with the fast, secure browser". As if there was any material difference between the browsers. We need a comeback of antitrust enforcement with teeth to get both Microsoft and Googl…

Its so weird that one company isnt mentioned, but will straight up not allow you to run any programs they want. These have dark patterns, but freedom still. (Not M$ anymore, they restore defaults with each update)

You're all over this thread being deliberately obtuse. Of course iOS is bad, that's not the point.

We're discussing desktop operating systems, Windows is the only one that deliberately messes with the default browser.

Re: Outlook now ignores Windows' Default Browser and opens links in Edge by default

#249

Post by globular-toast »

karlerss wrote: post #125

The web based outlook is an extremely well-polished and usable piece of software. You can use it in any browser you like.

It's honestly sad to think there are people who have never used good software.

Re: Outlook now ignores Windows' Default Browser and opens links in Edge by default

#250

Post by dizhn »

post-it wrote: post #116
kwanbix wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I really don't like to use Edge, and I don't like imposed changes, however if you read the article, it says that it can be turned off, or am I missing something? "Ultimately though, if this experience isn't right for you, you can turn off this feature the first time it launches in Microsoft Edge, and then in Outlook settings at any time after that."

And it'll inevitably turn itself back on after a mandatory upgrade, just like all the other user-hostile things you can turn off.

Like android playstore notifications. You can turn them off sure. But you'll keep getting the notification that reminds you to turn them on. You only have to say yes once. But it dutifully asks you again and again if you say no to something.

These things have become so yawn to me these days.

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