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Rust: The wrong people are resigning

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Re: Rust: The wrong people are resigning

#241

Post by pie_flavor »

caust1c wrote: post #99
twelfthnight wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wish we had more role models these days who were willing to disagree with decisions and work to fix them rather than loudly resign or point fingers. Feels like there is a lot of pressure these days that if you are part of a "bad" system then _you_ are bad, even if you are trying to improve it from the inside. So it's understandable people quit instead of taking on the burden of having to prove their "goodness", it's…

Golang has lots of good examples of design discussions without vitriol in their RFCs and proposals. There is the occasional bikeshedding and needless bickering granted, but it mostly stays civil and is the most mature language community I've ever had the pleasure of being a part of.

So does Rust. And Golang also has good examples of bad design discussions with vitriol, such as the one about metrics collection. This is a silly comparison.

Re: Rust: The wrong people are resigning

#242

Post by pie_flavor »

mort96 wrote: post #14

> Part of me is very disappointed in the enormous waste of time that is the “crablang” fork, and wishes the people involved could have engaged in a constructive manner instead. Any group who decides to fork Rust probably isn't in a position of power to turn the whole Rust Project and Rust Foundation into something less messy. Without knowing any of the specifics about this "crablang" fork, creating a well-resourced,…

'I know nothing about the situation, but this comment about it seems disingenuous' is not a great reasoning strategy. It's not well-resourced, it's not thoughtfully governed, and it wasn't a stewardship issue. It was people believing YouTube disinformation about what a trademark is for and what it implies, and forking the project just so that the name and logo could be changed to one sans trademark.

Re: Rust: The wrong people are resigning

#243

Post by lynguist »

Kwpolska wrote: post #187
robin_reala wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

“she/her” on @lina@vt.social

Asahi Lina is widely believed to be a persona of Hector Martin (aka marcan) https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35251905 and https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35238601 .

I never even thought about it before but you’ve convinced me.

Re: Rust: The wrong people are resigning

#244

Post by Zafira »

meindnoch wrote: post #86
d3nj4l wrote: post #8

In a way, I find this entire saga incredibly funny. There is so much hand wringing and pearl clutching at something that is supposedly in the shadows - this cabal of four or five people making decisions - that it makes the entire Rust "community" look juvenile. This is the kind of internecine conflict I should see in Anime discord servers, not about a language whose governance involves multiple major corporations!

>This is the kind of internecine conflict I should see in Anime discord servers Anime/furry culture has a significant overlap with the Rust community as far as I can tell as an outsider. E.g. there was that guy developing a Linux GPU driver for M1 Macs, narrating it with an anime "waifu" avatar and a speech plugin that makes you sound like a little girl from a Japanese cartoon.

How does one patch KDE2 under FreeBSD?

Re: Rust: The wrong people are resigning

#245

Post by solarkraft »

meindnoch wrote: post #86
d3nj4l wrote: post #8

In a way, I find this entire saga incredibly funny. There is so much hand wringing and pearl clutching at something that is supposedly in the shadows - this cabal of four or five people making decisions - that it makes the entire Rust "community" look juvenile. This is the kind of internecine conflict I should see in Anime discord servers, not about a language whose governance involves multiple major corporations!

>This is the kind of internecine conflict I should see in Anime discord servers Anime/furry culture has a significant overlap with the Rust community as far as I can tell as an outsider. E.g. there was that guy developing a Linux GPU driver for M1 Macs, narrating it with an anime "waifu" avatar and a speech plugin that makes you sound like a little girl from a Japanese cartoon.

I assume you're referring to Asahi Lina, who I believe presents as female.

Re: Rust: The wrong people are resigning

#246

Post by solarkraft »

Kwpolska wrote: post #187
robin_reala wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

“she/her” on @lina@vt.social

Asahi Lina is widely believed to be a persona of Hector Martin (aka marcan) https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35251905 and https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35238601 .

I have my suspicions about that, but it doesn't change the way they choose to present.

Re: Rust: The wrong people are resigning

#247

Post by solarkraft »

andrewflnr wrote: post #191
serial_dev wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am surprised how people pretend to be outraged over a fork of an open source language. They are outraged by the fork because having a fork reach thousand stars so quickly made it harder to ignore the reality that people who love the language were fed up with the leadership. Forking is the essence of open source software. Don't like something somebody else is doing with a software? It's open source, so you do it you…

Forking is a huge resource sink, if it goes anywhere at all. It disrupts network effects that software benefits from. It is, if nothing else, leaving a local maximum of utility for everyone. In short, it's inconvenient, if not actually painful and heralds future inconvenience/pain. Anger may not be wise, depending on the specifics, but it should absolutely not be surprising.

No fork: No change.

Re: Rust: The wrong people are resigning

#248

Post by adamrezich »

stoniejohnson wrote: post #227
DiggyJohnson wrote: post #220

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That race is a reasonable suspicion until barring further explanation/transparency. And additionally the “to be clear” refrain.

It might not be reasonable, but it is likely.

why?

upon what basis could you possibly make this claim?

Re: Rust: The wrong people are resigning

#249

Post by d3nj4l »

xoac wrote: post #44
d3nj4l wrote: post #8

In a way, I find this entire saga incredibly funny. There is so much hand wringing and pearl clutching at something that is supposedly in the shadows - this cabal of four or five people making decisions - that it makes the entire Rust "community" look juvenile. This is the kind of internecine conflict I should see in Anime discord servers, not about a language whose governance involves multiple major corporations!

Any reccomendations for Anime discord channels?

Most discords you can find on the discover tab are too big to be fun, so I’d suggest looking for communities around specific anime you like and branching from there.

Re: Rust: The wrong people are resigning

#250

Post by kbelder »

pg_1234 wrote: post #156
twelfthnight wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wish we had more role models these days who were willing to disagree with decisions and work to fix them rather than loudly resign or point fingers. Feels like there is a lot of pressure these days that if you are part of a "bad" system then _you_ are bad, even if you are trying to improve it from the inside. So it's understandable people quit instead of taking on the burden of having to prove their "goodness", it's…

The "don't leave, stay and fix things from the inside" pitch is how the political schemers try to pull the tech talent back into an arena where they can be worn down into submission, so that their skills can be co-opted by those whose only real talent is to steal the productivity of others. The only way to free a project from such entrenched rot is an ultimatum; "You can have the builders or the schemers, but not bot…

“If you saw Atlas, the giant who holds the world on his shoulders, if you saw that he stood, blood running down his chest, his knees buckling, his arms trembling but still trying to hold the world aloft with the last of his strength, and the greater his effort the heavier the world bore down upon his shoulders - What would you tell him?"

I…don't know. What…could he do? What would you tell him?"

To shrug.”

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