I wouldn’t take the figures quoted in this article seriously. I pay the equivalent of 13c/KWh in Australia, and that’s after recent price rises (thanks Vlad).
> I pay the equivalent of 13c/KWh in Australia
How??
Electricity Prices by Country
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Re: Electricity Prices by Country
#242Earlier quoted context omitted.
Up to a point. Long term the idea is to get rid of fossil fuels entirely and there are good indications that this is achievable.
During this fall when journalist was interviewing every kind of energy scientists, the estimates landed around 30-50 years from now before those fossil fuel replacements will start to be built at grid scale. That is a very long time into the future, with a very high uncertainty.
There are already grid scale chemical batteries being built, i.e. in Australia. Hydro has been used as a grid scale buffer for decades.
Re: Electricity Prices by Country
#243What I often notice when reading articles like this is people aren't aware of how electricity is priced in different countries. When I was in the UK I had one headline figure of price per KWh that covered everything. This seems to apply in a few European countries too. In Canada however I have a price per KWh and then about 7 or so different extra charges on my bill (local access fees, trasmissions charges, rate ride…
I was going to post to say exactly the same thing. I recently moved Ontario, Canada to BaWü Germany. Yes, the kWh price is 3 times higher here, but I can find a contract where I pay about 9 euro a month for delivery, compared to $40 CAD I was paying (after rebates) every month on various fees back in Ontario. Most months I paid more for delivery than my usage back home. It’s nice to have the majority of my energy bill under my control.
Normalizing prices to USD also makes little sense, as I don’t get paid in USD in either country. Normalizing to daily income makes more sense, even though that’s not a perfect measure of affordability (I pay more for electricity but less for internet/cell service, for example). A more interesting measure to me is how many people struggle to pay an average household electricity bill.
That said, I completely agree with other commenters that Germany’s closing of nuclear plants was a big mistake, if not from the energy pricing point of view, then from an environmental impact perspective. I can see a coal burning plant in the far distance from my office window, and I’d much rather that thing was shut down then the nuclear plants.
Re: Electricity Prices by Country
#244Living in Germany I can only say electricity prices are my least concern. Apart from the high costs for social insurances, the rise of rents and housing prices is what really cuts into your budget in Germany.
Re: Electricity Prices by Country
#245Earlier quoted context omitted.
England has ~25,000 sqft per person. That's the simple inverse of population density. Everything has to come out of that budget.
You can build up... Unfortunately in the UK apartments are associated with the dirty poors, so people prefer to live in awful tiny houses over spacious apartments.
> Unfortunately in the UK apartments are associated with the dirty poors
No they're not. If anything they're associated with dodgy leasehold, dodgy management fees and dogdy cladding.
None of which are usually issues in a house.
Otherwise there are a lot of luxury apartments.
Re: Electricity Prices by Country
#246Living in Germany I can only say electricity prices are my least concern. Apart from the high costs for social insurances, the rise of rents and housing prices is what really cuts into your budget in Germany.
Rents increase to suck all money out of the system. The more you are productive and the more you earn the more the rentiers will charge.
Unless supply is higher than all possible demand that will always be the way, but people won’t actually tackle this because some old dear in a 5 bed house they inherited 50 years ago might have to pay their way
Re: Electricity Prices by Country
#247Living in Germany I can only say electricity prices are my least concern. Apart from the high costs for social insurances, the rise of rents and housing prices is what really cuts into your budget in Germany.
Rents increase to suck all money out of the system. The more you are productive and the more you earn the more the rentiers will charge. Unless supply is higher than all possible demand that will always be the way, but people won’t actually tackle this because some old dear in a 5 bed house they inherited 50 years ago might have to pay their way
This is why standard of living didn't increase once women entered the workforce en mass.
Re: Electricity Prices by Country
#248Re: Electricity Prices by Country
#249Earlier quoted context omitted.
To think there were nuclear reactors already built and running perfectly fine in Germany. That were closed down presumably for ecological reasons. Burning coal and natural gas instead.
They werent that many to begin with they growing increasingly expensive to run, were coming to the end of their lifespan and Fukushima was a risk that was hard to ignore. It's interesting how Poland's electricity mix has been 80% coal for decades and this passes without comment, but what really enrages some people is a few nuclear power plants in Germany being mostly swapped out with solar and wind energy. Doesnt see…
> Fukushima was a risk that was hard to ignore.
Politically hard to ignore? Yes.
Practicaly hard to ignore? No. Germany doesn't get any tsunamis and even if it did, the consequences of a fukushima level accident every few decades are less bad than the direct pollution effects of coal, even ignoring the CO2.
Re: Electricity Prices by Country
#250Earlier quoted context omitted.
It is a paradox. The more renewables you will build, the more dependent on fossil fuels you will become.
Up to a point. Long term the idea is to get rid of fossil fuels entirely and there are good indications that this is achievable.
I don't yet know of a storage solution that wouldn't increase electricity prices by $0.60/kwh if we switched fully to solar and wind. Its actually much cheaper to just go full 100% nuclear and export your excess.