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Amazon Ring cameras used in nationwide ‘swatting’ spree, US Justice Dept. says

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Re: Amazon Ring cameras used in nationwide ‘swatting’ spree, US Justice Dept. says

#241

Post by shapefrog »

WalterBright wrote: post #193
cortesoft wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know, I have been a professional software developer for 15 years, and my whole house is smart. The trade offs are worth it to me.

I still have no idea why anyone would want automated light switches. Unless they are bedridden. The conventional light switches never fail. The dimmer switches go out every 5 years or so, and I eventually get fed up and just replace them with a conventional switch. I've had programmable thermostats, but the user interfaces on them are so terrible I eventually replace them with one with a simple dial and thermostat.

> I still have no idea why anyone would want automated light switches.

Security.

Re: Amazon Ring cameras used in nationwide ‘swatting’ spree, US Justice Dept. says

#242

Post by mbg721 »

shapefrog wrote: post #241
WalterBright wrote: post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I still have no idea why anyone would want automated light switches. Unless they are bedridden. The conventional light switches never fail. The dimmer switches go out every 5 years or so, and I eventually get fed up and just replace them with a conventional switch. I've had programmable thermostats, but the user interfaces on them are so terrible I eventually replace them with one with a simple dial and thermostat.

> I still have no idea why anyone would want automated light switches. Security.

The security part is a solved problem, unless you think a burglar is obsessed with your house in particular; they've made outlet timers for decades.

Re: Amazon Ring cameras used in nationwide ‘swatting’ spree, US Justice Dept. says

#243

Post by shapefrog »

mbg721 wrote: post #242
shapefrog wrote: post #241

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I still have no idea why anyone would want automated light switches. Security.

The security part is a solved problem, unless you think a burglar is obsessed with your house in particular; they've made outlet timers for decades.

automated light switches == outlet timers for decades

> unless you think a burglar is obsessed with your house in particular

IMO burglars are obsessed with an easy score - "Lights on looks like someone is home - fuck it I will rob the empty looking house up the street"

Re: Amazon Ring cameras used in nationwide ‘swatting’ spree, US Justice Dept. says

#244

Post by mbg721 »

shapefrog wrote: post #243
mbg721 wrote: post #242

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The security part is a solved problem, unless you think a burglar is obsessed with your house in particular; they've made outlet timers for decades.

automated light switches == outlet timers for decades > unless you think a burglar is obsessed with your house in particular IMO burglars are obsessed with an easy score - "Lights on looks like someone is home - fuck it I will rob the empty looking house up the street"

Well yes, but my point was that you don't need a Smart House in order to do the job of a $10 hardware store device.

Re: Amazon Ring cameras used in nationwide ‘swatting’ spree, US Justice Dept. says

#245

Post by ClumsyPilot »

ummonk wrote: post #52
ClumsyPilot wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It already is considered attempted murder by some localities Is there a link to this? The government decided that calling another branch of the government for help is so dangerous it is an attempt to murder?

It’s calling a branch of the government and describing a situation involving imminent or ongoing violence which the government is expected (though not legally obligated) to respond to.

BY making it worse?

It's one thing that it happens, but the fact that it is being normalised is what's truly repugnant. 'Swatting' someone in Britain does not cause any deaths.

Re: Amazon Ring cameras used in nationwide ‘swatting’ spree, US Justice Dept. says

#246

Post by shapefrog »

mbg721 wrote: post #244
shapefrog wrote: post #243

Earlier quoted context omitted.

automated light switches == outlet timers for decades > unless you think a burglar is obsessed with your house in particular IMO burglars are obsessed with an easy score - "Lights on looks like someone is home - fuck it I will rob the empty looking house up the street"

Well yes, but my point was that you don't need a Smart House in order to do the job of a $10 hardware store device.

My lights coming on and going off at set times of day or the porch light coming on in response to motion then going off again when nobody is there is "Smart".

Re: Amazon Ring cameras used in nationwide ‘swatting’ spree, US Justice Dept. says

#247

Post by scottlamb »

Xylakant wrote: post #201
scottlamb wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Good? As a Californian who doesn't own a gun and hasn't fired one in 20 years, I'm unlikely to take advantage of that law, but I appreciate that it exists. A SWAT assault that isn't preceded by presenting a valid warrant is just a heavily-armed home invasion, and home owners absolutely should be able to respond to those. That was presumably already legal, but if "enshrining" it into law as you put it makes it pointed…

If you think about it in practical terms, I don’t think this is a good law. What’s going to happen if a house owner is opening fire at a heavily armed police team that is conducting an illegal raid. Is the police going to stand down and reassess the legality of their entry? Or are they going to shoot back? And what’s the likely outcome? Dead owner and dead police. Great. Now, if you’d really want to dissuade the poli…

> Now, if you’d really want to dissuade the police from making illegal raids...

Why not both?

I don't think it's necessarily wise for a homeowner to open fire when outnumbered like that, but it's their right to make that choice when armed intruders break into their home. (And really without the whole knock, announcement, warrant thing the home owner doesn't know the intruders are police.) Making this clear shouldn't exclude these other excellent ideas.

Re: Amazon Ring cameras used in nationwide ‘swatting’ spree, US Justice Dept. says

#248

Post by mbg721 »

shapefrog wrote: post #246
mbg721 wrote: post #244

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well yes, but my point was that you don't need a Smart House in order to do the job of a $10 hardware store device.

My lights coming on and going off at set times of day or the porch light coming on in response to motion then going off again when nobody is there is "Smart".

That's actually smart, without my mocking scare-quotes. I think we very much agree, but I'm responding in the context of one parent higher comment than you are.

Re: Amazon Ring cameras used in nationwide ‘swatting’ spree, US Justice Dept. says

#249

Post by coeneedell »

sofixa wrote: post #199
coeneedell wrote: post #179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If I was being held hostage and in imminent danger of being killed, I would prefer an armed response.

Is that an educated preference - you have looked up your chances of survival in an armed response vs a negotiated one, or an instinct?

In this hypothetical we’re beyond negotiation anyway. I think I made this clear with the clause “in imminent danger of being killed”. If hostage negotiation were possible, that would not be imminent danger of being killed.

I’m a member of a minority group that is currently experiencing an uptick in violence from the American public. I’m generally a good-natured person and tend not to make enemies. If someone is in my home with a firearm, they’re there to kill me for my perceived connections to big banking, a rational person does not commit random acts of violence like that.

You do, unintentionally, make a stellar point though. If someone in my part of America called the police because someone was trying to kill me, there will likely not be a police response once they see the last name of the target.

Hostage negotiations have a high success rate. It’s one of the very few things to be proud of about our law enforcement strategy. That being said, hostage crises generally happen in public places, and can only be successful if terrorism is not the goal. I would be deeply surprised if anyone decided to attack specifically me if their goal was not to strike fear into my community.

Re: Amazon Ring cameras used in nationwide ‘swatting’ spree, US Justice Dept. says

#250

Post by jackmott42 »

throwaway09223 wrote: post #84
paxys wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The funny thing is, while "to protect yourself from government tyranny" is the favorite phrase of gun enthusiasts and gun lobbies in this country, whenever a citizen uses a gun in justifiable defense against police (the most recent notable one being Breonna Taylor's case) these same people side with the police every time.

This is inaccurate. I know many people on both sides of the gun debate and I don't know a single person who doesn't want police reform regarding no-knock raids. I don't know a single gun owner who supports the police in the Breonna Taylor incident. The overwhelmingly vast majority of "protect yourself from government tyranny" types want to massively curtail police powers.

Weird that we can't vote for that then. Seems like you may be counting wrong.
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