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Valve is paying open-source developers to work on Proton, Mesa, and more

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Re: Valve is paying open-source developers to work on Proton, Mesa, and more

#241

Post by bombolo »

CamperBob2 wrote: post #215
bombolo wrote: post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But the called functions need to be loaded in memory for every process using them, instead of once. Also there is value in being able to fix a library without having to recompile everything.

Also there is value in being able to fix a library without having to recompile everything. Number of times I have benefited from this process: 0 (AFAIK) Number of times this process has hosed previously-working applications and components: too many to count On Windows, this "feature" was called "DLL Hell," and was generally considered a bad thing. Nothing has fundamentally changed since it was a common practice for e…

> Number of times I have benefited from this process: 0 (AFAIK)

Every day on my distribution, when I have to download 5kb of library instead of 3GB of everything recompiled…

Re: Valve is paying open-source developers to work on Proton, Mesa, and more

#242

Post by mgrandl »

demux wrote: post #208
freedomben wrote: post #100

If anyone from Valve is reading this, I'm not a gamer at all, but I bought a (fully loaded) SteamDeck largely to support your efforts, and secondly to have a cool portable computer. It is (in about a week) going to become a game console hooked up to my TV. I could have got an xbox for much less the price, but the openness, power, and linuxyness of the steamdeck was too attractive to pass up :-D Please keep it up! you…

Has anyone successfully run SteamDeck's version of arch on a pc for gaming+dev? I'm looking to do this but I'd love to hear anecdotes

You can simply use the steam decks UI on any Linux system and it works great on AMD. Hardware acceleration on Nvidia is somehow super messed up still, so not recommended for those just yet.

Re: Valve is paying open-source developers to work on Proton, Mesa, and more

#243

Post by LarryMullins »

yazzku wrote: post #223
LarryMullins wrote: post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To be clear, you're joking right now, right? I think you must be, but given your previous comment I'm not sure. Dry sarcasm in text is hard...

No, I am not. Linus is not exactly an average person; it seems perfectly reasonable to me that among his many eccentricities would be the belief that only some people play games on a PC. Maybe I have been reading too many of his emails.

He's aware that video games exist, so obviously he knows some people play video games. I don't really see how you could confuse this.

Re: Valve is paying open-source developers to work on Proton, Mesa, and more

#244

Post by izacus »

martin82 wrote: post #236
freedomben wrote: post #100

If anyone from Valve is reading this, I'm not a gamer at all, but I bought a (fully loaded) SteamDeck largely to support your efforts, and secondly to have a cool portable computer. It is (in about a week) going to become a game console hooked up to my TV. I could have got an xbox for much less the price, but the openness, power, and linuxyness of the steamdeck was too attractive to pass up :-D Please keep it up! you…

I hope your kids are not expecting high end gaming experiences and are happy with simple indie games (which usually are the better games anyways), because the SteamDeck cannot and never will replace something like an XBox.

Steam Deck comfortably runs high end AAA games like God of War, Horizon Zero Dawn and Cyberpunk 2077, in many ways with comparable performance of the base Xbox model.

Which makes sense since the hardware is similar.

So I have no idea what you're talking about, it can easily replace Xbox.

Re: Valve is paying open-source developers to work on Proton, Mesa, and more

#245

Post by pjmlp »

horsawlarway wrote: post #93
pjmlp wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are the ones that need to get over the fact that these are Windows games, not Linux.

These games are targeting an ABI that happens to have come from MS. My fucking linux machine runs on intel hardware that is targeting an arch made by AMD (x86_64). There is no problem with sharing stable interfaces. The idea that we should not treat these as linux games because they consume an interface developed by MS, that is implemented just fine by proton on linux is... very very backwards. Who gives a flying fuc…

Nah, backwards is jumping of joy by only having games via "emulation" of other platforms, regardless of how it is implemented.

Re: Valve is paying open-source developers to work on Proton, Mesa, and more

#246

Post by pjmlp »

tpush wrote: post #74
pjmlp wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are the ones that need to get over the fact that these are Windows games, not Linux.

What does 'getting over' even mean here? These games are coded to APIs provided by Windows; but there's nothing stopping another platform from implementing these same APIs and happily running these games on not-Windows.

They are not Linux games...

Re: Valve is paying open-source developers to work on Proton, Mesa, and more

#247

Post by pjmlp »

smoldesu wrote: post #64
pjmlp wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are the ones that need to get over the fact that these are Windows games, not Linux.

What is there to get over? They run better on Linux most of the time, plus I don't need to groan when Microsoft asks me to enable the Windows™ Gaming Hub™.

Great, I guess we can forget about SDL and friends, and start adding a note "Want this on Linux? Ask Valve".

Re: Valve is paying open-source developers to work on Proton, Mesa, and more

#249

Post by pjmlp »

hellotomyrars wrote: post #182
pjmlp wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hence why Valve should make the needful to change that, instead of "emulating" Windows.

They tried earlier on before they realized this approach made way, way more sense. Even the native linux versions of games that have them often run worse than the windows version wrapped in Proton. Developers just aren't going to commit to making native linux versions for the most part and that isn't going to change. This is reality. The magical thing is that they've done so much work with Proton that a device like t…

Yeah, a hooping change from 1 to 2%, to another 20 years.

Re: Valve is paying open-source developers to work on Proton, Mesa, and more

#250

Post by pjmlp »

Ericson2314 wrote: post #126
pjmlp wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Those Linux only features don't matter because games are targeting Win32.

The promise is that they start targetting Proton or devices like the steam deck in particular.

They already do that by targeting Windows, and letting Valve do the work, no need for more development costs.
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