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Dutch employee fired by U.S. firm for shutting off webcam awarded €75K in court

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241–250 of 466 posts

Re: Dutch employee fired by U.S. firm for shutting off webcam awarded €75K in court

#241
post #106

he was ordered to take part in a virtual training period called a "Corrective Action Program." This is the sort of name given to processes uses when an employee is already performing below expectations. (Where I work it’s a more euphemistic Performance Improvement). If that’s the case here then his firing was a bit less sudden than it appears. Though the entire monitoring process seems draconian regardless.

The article also states that he was "telemarketing worker" without much detail about his job duties. Was the company already recording his screen and voice (if applicable) interactions with customers?

from the article

> The telemarketing worker replied back two days later, “I don't feel comfortable being monitored for 9 hours a day by a camera. This is an invasion of my privacy and makes me feel really uncomfortable. that's the reason why my camera isn't on. You can already monitor all activities on my laptop and I am sharing my screen.”

Re: Dutch employee fired by U.S. firm for shutting off webcam awarded €75K in court

#242
post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Like paying schools from taxes and never have kids, or paying fire fighters and your house never burns. It's called society.

Well I would prefer they send me a bill directly for fire services monthly, like water instead of having it obfuscated in general taxation. I prefer user fees not taxation. as for schools, to the extent I support their funding (which is more limited than I suspect you do) it is generally ethically justified because I too attended schools paid for by taxation, so in that manner I paying off a debt vs paying for others…

> for fire services monthly, like water instead of having it obfuscated in general taxation. I prefer user fees not taxation.

That would have to be mandatory service though (remember, firemen can perform inspections, fine people etc. - they're not there just for fighting fires), at which point it's just simpler to pay for that through taxes.

Re: Dutch employee fired by U.S. firm for shutting off webcam awarded €75K in court

#243
post #238

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Between this, and them shuttering any official EU accounts or presence after the award, I really foubt they will pay the award, and it seems unlikely they were contributing or collecting any taxes related to the employment.

IANAL, but the person terminated would probably have some pretty good arguments in a US based lawsuit. More money to be awarded by the court in case he wins too.

Way more expensive legal fees though, and a much slower "justice" system.

In the Netherlands court, the legal fees were sub 1k, and the decision happened less than 2 months from the filing.

Re: Dutch employee fired by U.S. firm for shutting off webcam awarded €75K in court

#244

Earlier quoted context omitted.

sorry what extra work? you know the company is able to hire more people right?

You know companies have budgets right? you can not just "hire more people" and remain profitable, no profit no company. Companies are not charities created to employ people. So sure if only 1 person is off on leave most likely another person could be hired But 5 years of protected leave..... What percentage of the work force is going to be out on that? Also since it is very hard to terminate someone in the EU, what h…

> What percentage of the work force is going to be out on that?

Its the workforce who votes for those laws. The workforce in Europe are not propagandized fools to the extent that they vote against their interests.

Re: Dutch employee fired by U.S. firm for shutting off webcam awarded €75K in court

#245

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That’s not that terrible idea - it removes some of the stigma and potentially helps ensure the program provides value rather than just being a checkbox on the way to termination.

It's still a checkbox used during termination.

I also don't see how going through it reduces the stigma. The stigma exists _because_ of the experience, not the unfamiliarity of it. For instance, does the experience of going through US airport security ever reduce the stigma of it?

Re: Dutch employee fired by U.S. firm for shutting off webcam awarded €75K in court

#246
post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

European in general. My wife works for a biotech company in Austria which was recently aquired by an american company and it's so funny to hear about their efforts to adapt to EU law and culture. Most of their training material is still unchanged from their US branch so there are things they list as benefits for all employees like - 3 Weeks paid vacation (we get 5 by law) - Health insurance (you know the drill) - 3 w…

>>(we get 1 year for 80% pay, first 6 months full pay, then 5 years protection against dismissal) That is just crazy.... I would hate to be a chidless person in your country, I can not image the extra amount of work that get places on people that do not have children... As someone that will never have a child I like the fact that the US does not force this kind of parental leave on employers, I know that will be very…

Uh... Weren't you a kid at some point? And weren't all your coworkers children at some point? Seems like you would benefit from the policy no matter how badly you don't want to participate in the task of childrearing.

Re: Dutch employee fired by U.S. firm for shutting off webcam awarded €75K in court

#247
post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is not a hot take my friend? Do you pay your taxes? Sales taxes? Does the company you work for pay their taxes? Do you intend on retiring with a pension at some point? Rising tides and boats comes to mind.

Well now we are going to get into more unpopular hot takes, because IMO income based taxation is theft.... I do not plain on retiring, and if I did I do not expect government social security (I am in the US) will be there to fund it so I do have a private retirement account that currently the US Monetary policy and government regulations/spending is doing its level best to destroy

> because IMO income based taxation is theft

Only in the ultra far right US. Where everything works so perfectly because of that belief.

https://www.businessinsider.com/asce-gives-us-infrastructure...

Re: Dutch employee fired by U.S. firm for shutting off webcam awarded €75K in court

#248
post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it’s a bad translation, the actual Dutch word being used is “ongehoorzaamheid”, which means something like “not following the rules”. I will say that it’s typically used in the context of raising children for example, but it’s definitely acceptable to use this word in Dutch in this context.

Then it is a correct translation, as that is what insubordination means.

[deleted]

Re: Dutch employee fired by U.S. firm for shutting off webcam awarded €75K in court

#250

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> IMO income based taxation is theft.... How could income based taxation be theft unless we're considering all profit theft? Either it's immoral for someone with power over you to demand part of the value you produce or it isn't.

Profit in a market economy is derived from a voluntary exchange of goods/services for currency. I buy a Ribeye because I obtian more value from the Ribeye than I do the $18 in my bank account, However if that ribeye goes to $25 I now value the $25 more than the Ribeye so I dont buy it instead I buy a Chicken Breast. These are choices I make in a free(ish) market. Companies offer their goods, I choose to buy or not Si…

> Income Taxation is in no way voluntary exchange like that

Take a weekend off and calculate how much 'fees' you would have to pay for 'private defense services', infrastructure, judiciary, police and all the other things if they were made private.

> The fact is that the government, like a common thief, says to a person: Your money, or your life

What religious delirium.

> But the robbery is none the less a robbery on that account; and it is far more dastardly and shameful.

The dastarty act of providing military, police, firefighting, law, justice, social services - all the things that make you live in a modern society instead of living in the former late feudal society where you wouldn't even have the social rank in order to be able to talk against your feudal lord in public like this.

There is no magical, divine, extraterrestrial or supernatural force that provides this modern society that you live in, and all the rights and freedoms that you have in that society. We, the people, have managed to make that happen through the mechanisms we invented. And one of those mechanisms is the state that is owned by its people.

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