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EU Commission is planning automatic CSAM scanning of private communications

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Re: EU Commission is planning automatic CSAM scanning of private communications

#241

Post by eru »

emteycz wrote: post #122
chinathrow wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The same as always. Do you have a guess about who is behind that lasting global push against private communications?

Why does it have to be a somebody? It's almost every politician since the invention of privacy. It's not a cabal, they just have common goals. Edit: can't reply. The endgame is control over the population - taxing them, imprisoning them, etc. Why? I don't know, some people just like to be in (absolute) power.

It's the government version of instrumental convergence.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Instrumental_convergence

Re: EU Commission is planning automatic CSAM scanning of private communications

#242

Post by eru »

pc86 wrote: post #176
vanderZwan wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It probably helps that we were complaining about and even making fun of[0] our government for using child pornography as an excuse for pushing through draconian populist laws a decade ago already. We may just happen to have a little head-start here basically. Edit: for the non-Dutch, the link goes to an article by the Dutch equivalent of The Onion and the headline says "Opstelten [our minister of Security and Justice…

The Netherlands seems great as an outsider. I've been to Amsterdam, which was too touristy for me, but still beautiful. And we took a train to Utrecht and the surrounding areas which was great. Even struck up a conversation with a group of (local) software developers on the train. Even with the lockdown protest issues it seems like it should be on the shortlist if you want to move to the EU as an American.

Keep in mind that comp for Dutch software developers is probably an order of magnitude lower than what you can get in the US.

Re: EU Commission is planning automatic CSAM scanning of private communications

#244

Post by seanw444 »

vidarh wrote: post #116
Freak_NL wrote: post #47

It's scary, because CSAM (child sexual abuse material) is very, very broad, and quite vague in its definition¹. My three year old son stayed with my parents for a week, and he was being taught to swim in their swimming pool. Of course, I get sent pictures and clips of his progress by a proud grandma, and of course, him being a toddler, he felt swimming trunks to be completely optional (and of course, they are at his…

I almost think these efforts will need to succeed in become applied in a way too authoritarian way before there's a sufficient backlash. Unfortunately that means there's likely to be a lot of collateral damage.

Seems that's the only way people end up caring to fix things these days.

Re: EU Commission is planning automatic CSAM scanning of private communications

#245

Post by pfortuny »

paganel wrote: post #216
Freak_NL wrote: post #47

It's scary, because CSAM (child sexual abuse material) is very, very broad, and quite vague in its definition¹. My three year old son stayed with my parents for a week, and he was being taught to swim in their swimming pool. Of course, I get sent pictures and clips of his progress by a proud grandma, and of course, him being a toddler, he felt swimming trunks to be completely optional (and of course, they are at his…

At this point I would never send nor have nude photos with my kids (whom I don't have, but hypothetically speaking) on my phone or on any other electronic device, doing otherwise is just asking for trouble. Maybe it's not the perfect situation for parents who want to share said photos with the kid's grandparents thousands of kilometres away but it is what it is.

Oh but OP is talking about his parents (the granparents) sending the photos.

And you already have received them!

Re: EU Commission is planning automatic CSAM scanning of private communications

#246

Post by seanw444 »

tluyben2 wrote: post #146
op00to wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unfortunately, here's what will really happen: 5:30am, loud knock at the door. You open the door a crack to see who it is. Cops bust in. You're immediately handcuffed and sat outside. Cops take anything with a screen, usb plug, etc. All your media. All your computers. All your external hard drives. Every one of these devices will be imaged, and archived prior to being searched. The data will be kept for years, to pro…

That won’t happen here but sure, US type of police overreach makes a better soundbite with horribly vague proposals like this. And people should be scared so I guess it’s good; maybe they will protest (probably not though because the children the children).

> That won't happen here

Ah, those famous words.

Re: EU Commission is planning automatic CSAM scanning of private communications

#247

Post by kevincox »

kayodelycaon wrote: post #120
chinathrow wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At this point, everything encrypted at rest will be a must.

Then encryption becomes evidence of guilt, unless you give up the key so they can search it to make sure you're not guilty.

This is not how it works at least in Canada and the US. Until they can read the password out of our minds (or at least prove that we have it) we don't need to give up the key.

Re: EU Commission is planning automatic CSAM scanning of private communications

#248

Post by eru »

stef25 wrote: post #223
pc86 wrote: post #199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> nobody wants to start falsely accusing innocent people I mean this is just blatantly false. History has shown us this is false. Even if you think the current government is fully comprised of kind-hearted, magnanimous, good people, what makes you think that will be the case for the next 10, 50, 100 years? A story - I have a google alert set up for my name. Someone in a different state with the same name was recently…

For starters, you seem to giving anecdotes from the US. Privacy laws in the EU differ from country to country but in some places at least, names & faces of people arrested suspects aren't published. And afaik these gross miscarriages of justice that seem to be ubiquitous in the US are nowhere near as common the EU. > But taking a step back, and acknowledging that someone innocent will get caught by this, as it's just…

> And afaik these gross miscarriages of justice that seem to be ubiquitous in the US are nowhere near as common the EU.

Not sure. There's a lot of selection bias here: all of the US speaks English, which you can presumably understand.

Local scandals in some obscure EU country might only be reported in languages you don't understand.

Re: EU Commission is planning automatic CSAM scanning of private communications

#249

Post by bobmichael »

foverzar wrote: post #127
searchableguy wrote: post #2

Could push for increasing surveillance be related to the recent adoption of digital social credit, CBDC (digital currency), and predictive policy systems in EU countries such as itlay, Netherlands, denmark, and the US? You would need a continous stream of data for building those. It makes a lot of sense if you look at it as countries trying to replicate success of Chinese growth and systems which are highly centraliz…

> trying to replicate success of Chinese growth and systems which are highly centralized and depend on the above factors There are actually no such functioning "social credit" systems in China. It is mostly a boogeyman narrative.

Source?

Re: EU Commission is planning automatic CSAM scanning of private communications

#250

Post by seanw444 »

_Algernon_ wrote: post #201
newsclues wrote: post #196

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Encrypted data will be illegal for plebs. Failure to hand over passwords will be punished as if you are guilty of the worst thing imaginable.

I doubt it because at that point they cant pretend anymore to have rule of law, or being a democracy. Sure, it could be a gradual decent into such a reality, but it will take a long time.

If they can justify to legislators being able to spy on all network traffic, they can probably also convince those same legislators that encryption is a tool only bad guys use to prevent justice being served.

There's a constant push, at least in the US, for regulation on encryption. It's gotten consistently shot down thus far, thankfully. But it's a never-ending battle. And one day people will most likely become complacent enough to let go and feel the liberty melt away.

Just like the last couple generations have gotten increasingly soft on our right to bear arms. They've been conditioned to believe that it's dangerous, and boomer-like, and no longer important.

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