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Twitter is using its embedded JavaScript to hide tweets that have been deleted

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Re: Twitter is using its embedded JavaScript to hide tweets that have been deleted

#241

Post by theelous3 »

bennyp101 wrote: post #195
fphhotchips wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I disagree. Twitter doesn't own that content. Someone posting the Twitter JS on their website to allow Twitter to format the tweet to Twitter's brand standards and allow a link to drive traffic back to Twitter is a favour that they're doing Twitter. They should respect that favour by not changing the contract unilaterally.

Yea, I don't think people are embedding tweets on their sites to do Twitter a favour ... it's because they want to reference something and part of the TOS says to use it.

This is hilariously disingenuous.

You rightly point out the ridiculous claim, noting people don't use embeds as a favour to twitter - and then make the ten times more ridiculous claim that people are using embeds because of the TOS.

At least try and hide the fact you're being bad faith if you're going to engage like this.

Re: Twitter is using its embedded JavaScript to hide tweets that have been deleted

#242

Post by theelous3 »

montroser wrote: post #219
medler wrote: post #184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You, and many in these comments, seem to be conflating twitter’s legal rights with their informal social obligations. No one is saying this is illegal behavior by Twitter. Some are saying it’s very annoying of them to go back on their established policies and break thousands of websites.

I totally agree it's annoying, and at odds with what we would hope for their social obligations. So sure, shame on them. But also, we could not actually expect anything different. The capitalist/corporate environment in which we operate will systematically compel these companies to choose profits over social obligations. They are accountable to their customers (advertisers), and so whatever moral transgressions we pe…

> But also, we could not actually expect anything different. The capitalist/corporate environment in which we operate will systematically compel these companies to choose profits over social obligations.

This is a very poor argument. It does not necessarily follow that profit seeking results in this outcome, in fact it could easily be the opposite case, and so your assertion has no footing.

Re: Twitter is using its embedded JavaScript to hide tweets that have been deleted

#243

Post by cxr »

genidoi wrote: post #199
hamilyon2 wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do web browsers nowadays have a way to save a part of html dom with every style inlined? If not, that is a huge opportunity.

SinglePage the chrome extension does this I believe

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30527999>

See also: https://gildas-lormeau.github.io/>

Re: Twitter is using its embedded JavaScript to hide tweets that have been deleted

#244

Post by fphhotchips »

LadyCailin wrote: post #204
fphhotchips wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I disagree. Twitter doesn't own that content. Someone posting the Twitter JS on their website to allow Twitter to format the tweet to Twitter's brand standards and allow a link to drive traffic back to Twitter is a favour that they're doing Twitter. They should respect that favour by not changing the contract unilaterally.

But, you as the website operator don’t own that content either? Certainly I have some level of expectation that if I delete something, it may very well actually be gone, right? And further, that Twitter taking steps to do exactly that in places they control is reasonable?

> Certainly I have some level of expectation that if I delete something, it may very well actually be gone, right?

Really? For me this is like saying that just because you stop actively publishing a book, people can never quote it again. That's clearly not true, right?

Edit: or because I didn't distribute recordings of a speech I made, newspapers can't quote me

Re: Twitter is using its embedded JavaScript to hide tweets that have been deleted

#245

Post by fphhotchips »

bennyp101 wrote: post #195
fphhotchips wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I disagree. Twitter doesn't own that content. Someone posting the Twitter JS on their website to allow Twitter to format the tweet to Twitter's brand standards and allow a link to drive traffic back to Twitter is a favour that they're doing Twitter. They should respect that favour by not changing the contract unilaterally.

Yea, I don't think people are embedding tweets on their sites to do Twitter a favour ... it's because they want to reference something and part of the TOS says to use it.

The TOS on quoting someone? You're saying that if I want to quote something someone says on Twitter in my book or in a newspaper, I have to follow their TOS and style it their way? No, I think not. Applying Twitter's styling to quotes is a nicety. It's nice for the blogger that it looks good on a blog and it's nice for Twitter that they get a link back and their branding guidelines get followed, but there's no way Twitter is going to be able to enforce their TOS on quoting something that someone else said just because it was said on their platform.

Re: Twitter is using its embedded JavaScript to hide tweets that have been deleted

#246

Post by jdrc »

cxr wrote: post #229
jdrc wrote: post #228

Earlier quoted context omitted.

it doesnt inherit style etc. it s also a completely different document for scripting purposes. it s also rather heavy, hard to have 100 iframes in a page

Side note: this would have been a lot easier if in response to, "do you want that snippet not to be sandboxed?" you'd just said, "yes". What you're proposing stands little chance of being implemented, given the security implications.

it s just an idea not a proposal. it would be sandboxed, the idea is to allow html only, so as to avoid scripting. don't we do that all the time with ajax?

Re: Twitter is using its embedded JavaScript to hide tweets that have been deleted

#247

Post by macspoofing »

raverbashing wrote: post #183
macspoofing wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>with the original author of the tweet. Not necessarily. The example VOX article[1] had Trump's tweets embedded in the article, which are now hidden. Trump didn't delete those tweets. He was banned. [1] https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2018/4/13/17233422/d...

There are many more cases of deletions than banned ones, let's not think of the exception as the rule And the blog author still has the text as well

>There are many more cases of deletions than banned ones, let's not think of the exception as the rule

But that isn't the exception. Banned users tend to be the ones that have some level of public interest, as evidenced by the VOX quote.

>And the blog author still has the text as well

That's right and maybe in some way this new policy accidentally leads to good things, in that it may incentive sites that embed Twitter's content on their page, to simply bypass that.

Re: Twitter is using its embedded JavaScript to hide tweets that have been deleted

#248

Post by smaryjerry »

batch12 wrote: post #176
tofuahdude wrote: post #16

You don't need to use Twitter's JS to show Tweets. If you choose to use their system, you're subject to their rules. If you don't like their rules, don't use their stuff. Calling it "altering the public record" is a little hyperbolic imo. If you want to act as a repository for the public record, you better use your own system. Twitter is under no obligation to retain this kind of stuff on your behalf. I'm not trying…

It is entertaining to watch the waves of opinion crash against each other when things happen that people don't like. The cognitive dissonance must must a deafening roar. On one hand, people get miffed when twitter changes their JS to block out quotes of deleted tweets, citing an alteration of the public record. On the other hand, people argue that twitter is not a "public square" and can do what they want with the co…

Right seems like people are confusing very different points of view: they can do it and they should do it. It’s like reviewing a murder case and seeing arguments talking past each other, one side saying “He was allowed to shoot his gun” and the other saying “He shouldn’t have shot his gun.” The arguments aren’t even on the same level and aren’t mutually exclusive. Both could be true, and the responses just ignore the others point completely.

Re: Twitter is using its embedded JavaScript to hide tweets that have been deleted

#250

Post by LadyCailin »

fphhotchips wrote: post #244
LadyCailin wrote: post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But, you as the website operator don’t own that content either? Certainly I have some level of expectation that if I delete something, it may very well actually be gone, right? And further, that Twitter taking steps to do exactly that in places they control is reasonable?

> Certainly I have some level of expectation that if I delete something, it may very well actually be gone, right? Really? For me this is like saying that just because you stop actively publishing a book, people can never quote it again. That's clearly not true, right? Edit: or because I didn't distribute recordings of a speech I made, newspapers can't quote me

But I am not, nor do I aspire to be, a public figure. For notable people, and most certainly politicians, I might tend to agree with you, but not for the general case.
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