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Amazon more than doubles max base pay to $350k

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Re: Amazon more than doubles max base pay to $350k

#241

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This doesn't match my experience. I guess it depends on the role but for engineers it's well known Amazon has been throwing large sign on bonuses to close the vesting gap for years. For instance I received an offer that was 160 base, 325 cash bonus and 5% of my RSUs for my first year, putting my TC at ~510k. Second year was a slightly smaller bonus, and 15% of my RSUs. Is it possible that when folks were voluntarily…

> I received an offer that was 160 base, 325 cash bonus and 5% of my RSUs for my first year, putting my TC at ~510k. I don't understand the appeal of cash signing bonuses. This just seems to me like another way of saying you got hired for a $485k annual salary while giving Amazon the freedom to cut your salary a year from now by up to ~67%. Why give your future self that risk instead of looking for a higher base sala…

One way to look at this is a way for employers and employees to cope with uncertainty.

The employee is likely to underperform for the first few comp cycles after being hired, due to the new role, new context, etc. So the employer is willing to guarantee an "optimistic" salary up front for the first year (or, with equity vests, perhaps longer).

But the employer is unwilling to guarantee this indefinitely; after a year or two, they want to see you performing at level--and thus qualifying for merit increases--or else you'll revert to the lower salary.

Viewed this way, a rational employer will offer you a lower total comp for the first year if it's all salary; taking more of your first year's comp as bonus represents a bet on your own impact (and the fairness of the merit-based comp modeling).

Re: Amazon more than doubles max base pay to $350k

#242

We had an office near an Amazon office. I interviewed a lot of people trying to leave Amazon. I don’t ask candidate’s compensation, but a lot of them volunteered it anyway. I was always surprised at how effectively low their comp was in the first few years due to the vesting schedule. The internet is adamant that everyone with FAANG jobs is rolling in TC, but there are a lot of people out there who are getting into F…

FAANG was a coping mechanism for Amazon employees. It was always just FANG.

Re: Amazon more than doubles max base pay to $350k

#243

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, that's how labor markets work.

At some point, no amount of money is worth it. I can hardly imagine earning $350k a year. I've never earned a third of that anually. What I can imagine is a job that places such a demand on my time and attention that I don't have time for a life outside of it.

You work there 3 years and you'll earn a million bucks. Plenty of life to live after that and a lot of money to do whatever it is you want. Many people are willing to make that tradeoff, perhaps not you though.

Re: Amazon more than doubles max base pay to $350k

#244

As a Googler I was approached by Amazon, and when I started to look at the culture, a photo came out with Jeff Bezos using a door because he was too ,,frugal’’ to buy a desk… I would never join an office where people are proud of that.

'Frugality' is an Amazon core value.

That's one of my issues with Amazon. 'Frugality' invites so many idiocies and abuses that I can't help but assume it's penny wise/pound foolish in practice, as well as lots of ill will.

Re: Amazon more than doubles max base pay to $350k

#245
post #145

Judging from what an insider in the HR org told me, we're going to be hearing a lot of stories like this going forward. Apparently, Amazon scale is so large and their attrition rates are so bad that in some markets, every potentially qualified candidate has already applied and failed an interview, or previously worked at Amazon and quit. As the adage goes, necessity is the mother of invention and Amazon seems to be a…

> every potentially qualified candidate has already applied and failed an interview, or previously worked at Amazon and quit. A company so large as to literally run out of humans. Happened with their warehouse workers too. https://www.essence.com/news/amazon-burning-through-workers/

> A company so large as to literally run out of humans

It's not the size, its the attrition that's the problem. Everything would be fine if they retained employees, but stackranks for the stackrank god.

Re: Amazon more than doubles max base pay to $350k

#246

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This doesn't match my experience. I guess it depends on the role but for engineers it's well known Amazon has been throwing large sign on bonuses to close the vesting gap for years. For instance I received an offer that was 160 base, 325 cash bonus and 5% of my RSUs for my first year, putting my TC at ~510k. Second year was a slightly smaller bonus, and 15% of my RSUs. Is it possible that when folks were voluntarily…

>For instance I received an offer that was 160 base, 325 cash bonus and 5% of my RSUs for my first year, putting my TC at ~510k. Second year was a slightly smaller bonus, and 15% of my RSUs. Jeebus man. What is it that you FAANG developers do that is so much more complex than what regular developers do? For reference: I do Angular and Python development. Is there like some open source project or code samples that giv…

> What is it that you FAANG developers do that is so much more complex than what regular developers do?

They quit when the numbers don't match what they feel they are worth. You see the same thing in finance. One bad year can send 20-30% of your workforce walking out the door in a matter of a few months post bonuses.

Re: Amazon more than doubles max base pay to $350k

#247

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This doesn't match my experience. I guess it depends on the role but for engineers it's well known Amazon has been throwing large sign on bonuses to close the vesting gap for years. For instance I received an offer that was 160 base, 325 cash bonus and 5% of my RSUs for my first year, putting my TC at ~510k. Second year was a slightly smaller bonus, and 15% of my RSUs. Is it possible that when folks were voluntarily…

> I received an offer that was 160 base, 325 cash bonus and 5% of my RSUs for my first year, putting my TC at ~510k. I don't understand the appeal of cash signing bonuses. This just seems to me like another way of saying you got hired for a $485k annual salary while giving Amazon the freedom to cut your salary a year from now by up to ~67%. Why give your future self that risk instead of looking for a higher base sala…

I don't follow. Are you saying Amazon might opt to not pay out the bonus as outlined in my offer letter for no other reason than a gotcha? I guess it's possible but highly unlikely...

Re: Amazon more than doubles max base pay to $350k

#249

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, that's how labor markets work.

At some point, no amount of money is worth it. I can hardly imagine earning $350k a year. I've never earned a third of that anually. What I can imagine is a job that places such a demand on my time and attention that I don't have time for a life outside of it.

At some point, no amount of money is worth it.

That's the point these companies don't get, and never will get.

All of their mouthed pronouncements about "wellness" and "work-life balance" notwithstanding.

Re: Amazon more than doubles max base pay to $350k

#250
post #145

Judging from what an insider in the HR org told me, we're going to be hearing a lot of stories like this going forward. Apparently, Amazon scale is so large and their attrition rates are so bad that in some markets, every potentially qualified candidate has already applied and failed an interview, or previously worked at Amazon and quit. As the adage goes, necessity is the mother of invention and Amazon seems to be a…

> this move seems reminiscent of Netflix's pay structure, in the sense of offering a higher cash portion but lower equity

I won't read it that way. This is upper threshold, not some number a L5 SDE would hope to get.

Frugality is still frugality.

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