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I Spent Hundreds of Hours Working in VR

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Re: I Spent Hundreds of Hours Working in VR

#241
post #231

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It used to be possible to buy a Quest 2 without the requirement of a Facebook account, but that freedom came at a premium cost.

They announced that they're dropping that requirement.

And the alternative is that you sign up for a Meta account so your info will just be shared anyway. It was a while ago they made that announcement and it hasn’t happened. I was going to get the Quest 2 but I came to the realization I don’t want to support that company so went with the Valve Index. Sure it doesn’t have wireless but I’m not going to take it anywhere anyway.

Re: I Spent Hundreds of Hours Working in VR

#242
I think when people have this big game changing ideas around VR, what they're generally imagining is actually is still not there. Low friction experiences that still allow freedom of movement. It is possible that VR tech evolves to the point that it can be a low friction experience (this is a bit debatable, but from my experiences I'd still call it a pretty big hassle).

Freedom of movement is the large one. Omni treadmills are one way of dealing with this, but anyone that has tried them knows that they are an awkward experience on their own (you can definitely get used to it, but you'll never mistake it for walking normally). They also massively increase the friction in using a VR headset.

If the virtual environment you were in was able to be dynamically projected over real world obstacles, then you'd be able to move freely... and you'd no longer be using VR but AR. The one thing I think VR is really accomplishing right now is pushing technology development that will allow AR in the future.

I do think that AR is going to be a defining breakout period for these technologies and VR is effectively dead in the water. Even a small whiff of AR in the form of Pokemon Go got people seriously jazzed and met those basic requirements I set out... Just without the immersion people are looking for out of VR.

Re: I Spent Hundreds of Hours Working in VR

#244
post #182

People don't seem to understand that VR was always an element of dystopian fiction. It's one of the things we do when we are confined to Earth. The others are gambling (with apes?), drugs, mindless hedonism (there's an app for that), following cults and crazy ideologies (Qanon? flat Earth?), pointless political intrigue, and war both physical and cultural. There will be a lot of sound and fury signifying nothing. Sta…

Not so crazy actually. I mostly agree with you. I can’t be bothered to work in IT anymore if it isn’t directly attached to something physical that makes our ecosystems better.

Re: I Spent Hundreds of Hours Working in VR

#245
post #236

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is also the frontier of transmigration to the digital realm which opens up whole new possibilities for mankind, especially immortality.

If this were isolation in a digital universe you'd end up with eternity in a questing/grinding RPG or something similar. That sounds like hell if it's even a form of consciousness. Eventually something happening in the outside world would destroy this system and everyone would die. There are open, growing, learning upward ascending futures and closed, repetitive, conflict-ridden downward spiral futures. Some kind of…

A variant of this hell is described, sort of, in Iain M Banks’ book Surface detail. Recommended.

Re: I Spent Hundreds of Hours Working in VR

#246
post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The tech works extremely well at making me feel sick. But you realize this is a you problem, right? Outside the handful of people who get motion sick with VR, the tech is rock solid. Everyone who tries an Index is blown away by how immersive the experience is. > VR chat is about as interesting as second life, and any metaverse that follows will follow the same path. You couldn't be more wrong. There's a reason Face…

The literature says it's 22-80% of people get sick using VR. Much more than a handful https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-021-91573-w

"Sick" is definitely a relative term. I've given literally thousands of demos to people--some of which were pretty janky, back in the early days--and I've yet to see anyone throw up from VR.

There is a very small minority of people who put on the headset and immediately can't stand it. I've seen maybe 2 or 3 people in the last 6 years, so it's definitely less than 1%.

Depending on content, I've seen about 50% of women and 25% of men experience mild discomfort after using the headset for about 30 minutes. Studies on simulator sickness include that in "feeling sick".

My current project is not able to use every single sim-sickness mitigating strategy available, due to the sort of source data we're using (a lot of flat, 360 imagery in a multi-user tour-like scenario), but even there, we've only had 1 out of 100 people express actual feelings of nausea after using the headset. If people report any discomfort at all, it's on their first time, after they've not heeded our warning to limit their first interaction to 30 minutes, and then they only mention feeling a little light headed.

People report feelings of nausea after playing 1st-person shooter video games on large screen monitors or watching shaky action movies at movie theaters. This is not a problem unique to VR.

Re: I Spent Hundreds of Hours Working in VR

#247

I wanted to love VR. I dreamed of having a headset when I was younger and kickedstarted the oculus rift. I imagined a million worlds that would be within virtual reach. It would be the coolest! VR has been nothing but a complete disappointment to me. Motion Sickness, headaches, sweaty headsets and detachment. Never played a VR game that wasn’t better without it, somewhat like 3D movies. I have my doubts this will eve…

One of my biggest hobbies is sim racing, and I can tell you that putting on the VR headset is akin to putting on a helmet and setting off on the track. The sweatiness and discomfort is nothing more than a real driver would experience, and turning a wheel feels real without hand tracking. What you're experiencing with disorientation does tend to go away for most people if they're careful about it. And for me, I litera…

Any racing games you can recommend? I couldn't find a good one (without trying them out).

Re: I Spent Hundreds of Hours Working in VR

#248

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Things I like: Immersed.com (second computer screen): I wish the Quest 2 had 4000x4000 per eye to make this work beautifully but I suppose that will be the future. Eleven Table Tennis: I practice smashing in this game, the skill transferred. Now I am beating all my friends with real actual table tennis (at an amateur level). Thrill of the Fight: awesome shadowboxing on steroids workout. Walkabout minigolf: feels like…

Great list. I would also recommend checking out some movies in Bigscreen. It supports 3D movies.

I have tried Bigscreen and will definitely use it in the future. The problem that I have with it currently is that the pixel density of the Quest 2 is too low. My friend that I watch movies with regularly has a plasma smart tv (or whatever you call them) and the detail is much more crystal clear.

Re: I Spent Hundreds of Hours Working in VR

#249
post #212

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Things I like: Immersed.com (second computer screen): I wish the Quest 2 had 4000x4000 per eye to make this work beautifully but I suppose that will be the future. Eleven Table Tennis: I practice smashing in this game, the skill transferred. Now I am beating all my friends with real actual table tennis (at an amateur level). Thrill of the Fight: awesome shadowboxing on steroids workout. Walkabout minigolf: feels like…

Eleven is an incredible game. I never particularly liked table tennis, probably because I was not good at it. Being able to practice in VR made it a lot more fun for me. The dev is extremely responsive. I even 3D printed a paddle attachment for the Oculus controller which is supported in-game. I recommend it every time I can because it's as much fun as I've had with a video game.

Where can I get more info about the paddle attachment? Someone on Reddit also talked about it.

Re: I Spent Hundreds of Hours Working in VR

#250

This is such a strange article. It doesn't present anything or explain how a VR workstation can actually work. Has anyone actually worked this way? I spent about an hour with a Vive headset and it was the most obnoxious experience I ever had. The lack of feedback, the requirements of a large room free of obstacle, the awful screen door effect, the poor precision from the dual wands. Overall, I was exhausted after jus…

This blog post goes into one person that claims they've spent 1000s of hours working in vR https://blog.immersed.team/working-from-orbit-39bf95a6d385 And when it hit HN https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28678041 For me, the Vive is too heavy for this. I have not personally used a Quest 2 more than 5 mins (not willing to use an FB account) but it is arguably slightly more comfortable than a Vive headset (not saying…

I tried the exact setup of this 1000+ hours person, having been excited by the concept of a monitor-less office for years.

My current setup is multiple 4k monitors in pixel-doubled resolution. It is relatively easy on the eyes and not too expensive ($300ish/monitor + VESA). I am working remotely and when I travel I have to work from my laptop and I would love to have a headset to replicate the multiple monitor experience on the go.

I have been hoping for this since the HTC Vive.

HTC Vive - simply too low resolution. Screen door effect visible. Also software such as Immersed was not available.

Replicating this 1000+ hour setup went as follows:

1. Buy a Quest 2. Meta has its issues however I have an account so no real issues on the Meta side other than Meta itself. Resolution is clearly superior to HTC Vive, with no obvious screen door effect. As the original poster mentions - the strap that comes with the Quest is terrible, and you will have to spend at least $100 to get the Quest to the point where it can be used continuously for long periods without the device itself being a distraction.

2. Immersed - Major issues with this software. Thankfully they give you a "pro" trial so you can try this without paying. Main issue was painlessly delivering what I wanted: screen closed multiple 4k-equivalent virtual monitors. On mac (preferred), there were issues with HDMI spoofing that I probably could have fixed with dongles had I desired. On windows the situation was better, but still finicky with resolution setting and seamless disconnect/reconnection. Would like to see more focus on integrating better resolution control as I imagine most users of the program want to use it as I do - without regard to attached monitors.

Turns out I should have done my homework before hand because a little math demonstrates why I was fooling myself that I could work with this setup:

via https://www.reddit.com/r/virtualreality/comments/99s1yr/what...

Measure the width of the monitor with which you usually work, call it W. Then measure the distance your eyes are typically away from it while you work, and call it D. Finally, determine the horizontal pixel count of your monitor when you work (like 1920 for a full HD monitor), and call it HPC. The resolution of your monitor in the center is then R = 1 / (2 * tan-1 ((W / HPC) / (2 * D))), in pixels/°. This resolution is the one you want. (For example, my resolution is 66 pixels/°, given I have a 28" diagonal 4k monitor that I view from 24" away.) The OG Vive's resolution is 11.4 pixels/° in the center. That's the resolution you have. To reach my monitor's resolution, the Vive's pixel count would have to be six times higher, or 6480x7200 per eye, everything else being the same.

Quest 2 resolution per eye is 1832 x 1920.

There is no way I could enjoy doing my job which consists of reading all day with such poor resolution, and I think we are a ways away from a solution.

Foveated rendering is a possible solution, however I don't see an easy answer.

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