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Elizabeth Holmes found guilty

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Re: Elizabeth Holmes found guilty

#241

Post by civilized »

sharkweek wrote: post #25

This will sound weird but I am a collector of swag from large companies that have collapsed due to anything from mismanagement to outright fraud. While we're a rare breed there are others like me out there. Still, even with this oddly specific marketplace being small, let me tell you, the Theranos swag market is hot right now (check eBay if you're curious). Wish I had gone big on this one earlier, because I have a fe…

I totally get this! I would LOVE to have some Theranos crap. Then I would fabricate stories about why I have it, just like a real Theranos CEO!

(Hmm... might as well fabricate the collectibles themselves, as some other commenters have suggested...)

Re: Elizabeth Holmes found guilty

#242

Post by jcranmer »

4rt wrote: post #199
jcranmer wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Short answer: "no." Longer answer: Theranos never really got their own custom machines working. Until those machines were working, they did use other machines and processes which did work. However, their entire shtick was trying to do a lot of tests on less blood than usual, so... they simply diluted the blood samples to get enough volume for those machines to function in the first place, and correspondingly, the res…

I think it goes further than that, the point is that scientifically the tests could never have worked. Carreyrou originally got tipped off by pathologists saying that this was impossible, then they got sued into oblivion (see thepathologyblawg). (IANAP but this is my understanding) Some real tests rely on having a huge blood sample (e.g. 100ml), being filtered (e.g. by centrifuge) and then a test of a known sensitivi…

My understanding is that the tests that Theranos actually ran on patients' blood was actually based on drawing blood from the veins, not the finger-prick test. While Theranos did want to do the finger-prick tests--and it wouldn't have worked for the reasons you mentioned--that they didn't get them working meant they couldn't get certification for actually running those tests. So they ran the tests they did get certification for (which was using venous blood draws), for the most part, but even then, they were running tests in ways that violated the procedures they were supposed to be using.

(I do realize that keeping track of how precisely Theranos was lying can be frustrating, since they were doing multiple levels of lying here.)

Re: Elizabeth Holmes found guilty

#243

Post by mkl »

sho_hn wrote: post #153
wrs wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One of my prized possessions is a Kozmo-branded CD opener, which I got by ordering a single CD from Kozmo, with free one-hour delivery. Thanks, venture capital!

What intrigued me about your comment is the reference to a "CD opener". I had no idea!

CD case opener, I believe: https://www.promotionalgiftwholesale.com/custom-cd-jewel-cas...

Re: Elizabeth Holmes found guilty

#245

Post by megablast »

kstrauser wrote: post #210
neom wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I followed the case very closely, read the transcripts I could find daily etc. What Elizabeth did wasn't far from what many many many founders do. This was held to a legal standard, sure, but let's be real here... since when was the legal standard the SV standard? Is SV really the bastion of morality and legal ethics? Is that the new norm, good behaviour? Notably some investors refused to participate and iirc Draper…

> people are having success with her ideas today Citation needed. The whole concept has a critical flaw, as pointed out by her engineering staff and medical advisors: blood tests require a certain minimum volume of blood to work, and that's inescapable because blood components are discrete, not continuous. For example, a drop of blood is about .05mL, or about 1/20th of a milliliter. A common testing sample size in a…

No need to poll 100 million. 20,000 is pretty accurate.

Re: Elizabeth Holmes found guilty

#246

Post by thechao »

sharkweek wrote: post #25

This will sound weird but I am a collector of swag from large companies that have collapsed due to anything from mismanagement to outright fraud. While we're a rare breed there are others like me out there. Still, even with this oddly specific marketplace being small, let me tell you, the Theranos swag market is hot right now (check eBay if you're curious). Wish I had gone big on this one earlier, because I have a fe…

My favorite tshirt is for a company picnic for Enron (scheduled for after it’s dissolution); the back is covered in MBAspeak: honesty, integrity, … It’s one of my favorites — up there with my Orwellian yellow plastic “Great Place To Work” Intel tamborine.

Re: Elizabeth Holmes found guilty

#247

Post by [deleted] »

sharkweek wrote: post #25

This will sound weird but I am a collector of swag from large companies that have collapsed due to anything from mismanagement to outright fraud. While we're a rare breed there are others like me out there. Still, even with this oddly specific marketplace being small, let me tell you, the Theranos swag market is hot right now (check eBay if you're curious). Wish I had gone big on this one earlier, because I have a fe…

[deleted]

Re: Elizabeth Holmes found guilty

#248

Post by lukewrites »

nemo44x wrote: post #177
paxys wrote: post #140

Guilty of taking a billion+ dollars from rich and influential people who couldn't bother to do the bare minimum due diligence into their investments due to greed and FOMO. Not guilty of endangering thousands of lives by running fraudulent and inaccurate tests under sub-par lab conditions. Our justice system is such a farce.

Our justice system works well. You are confusing your own emotional feelings for what you would have liked to see with the reality of what was able to be proven without reasonable doubt. The type of populist mob justice you allude* to is not just at all. *(Fixed grammar error specified below)

Eluded so completely from the comment that it didn’t appear at all.

Re: Elizabeth Holmes found guilty

#249

Post by k12sosse »

ghostbrainalpha wrote: post #147
sharkweek wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I try my best to only procure swag that was actually distributed by the company at time of operation. As an example, you can buy "joke" Enron t-shirts, which I wouldn't be interested in, but some authentic team building event-specific shirt distributed to 50ish people? Oh baby, I'm all ears. I think that's part of the fun, hunting for the original stuff.

Can you guys share your collection? I'm not a part of this hobby yet, but I'm immediately on board. Would you be interested in an unreleased "Cosby Show" lego set that was supposed to come out right before he got cancelled?

Is that where we are today? Admitting[0] to drugging women, and then sexually assaulting them under the influence qualifies as 'cancelling'? Weird.

0: https://www.cnn.com/2015/07/07/us/bill-cosby-quaaludes-sexua...

Re: Elizabeth Holmes found guilty

#250

Post by metadat »

testplzignore wrote: post #191
tptacek wrote: post #78

Time to kibitz on the likely sentence! You can get the federal sentencing guidelines here: https://www.ussc.gov/sites/default/files/pdf/guidelines-manu... They're long and mostly not relevant except for the sections pertaining to Holmes conduct. Here's the indictment: https://www.justice.gov/usao-ndca/page/file/1135066/download Holmes was found guilty of one 18 USC 1349 charge, and 3 18 USC 1343 charges; the 1343's s…

Based on a very quick reading, I think the most serious offense (the $100M one) would at least land in the 97-121 months bucket. If she serves half of that, best case for her is 4 years. Not too bad.

Hopefully she'll get more, SV could use a good example.

Otherwise it signals that wantrepeneurs can keep doing it with minimal repercussions.

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