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Belgian scientific base in Antarctica engulfed by Covid despite strict measures

brusselstimes.com

241–250 of 296 posts

Re: Belgian scientific base in Antarctica engulfed by Covid despite strict measures

#241
post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m not so sure; respectfully disagree. This only talks about process stricture, not efficacy or process compliance/lapse. Plausible hypothesis, but needs more data.

If I've learned something about people during the pandemic, it's that the average person is far less intelligent and far less compliant than I previously believed. I wouldn't be the least bit surprised to find out this was caused by people not complying with protocols. Or at the very least, not having an understanding of the fact that COVID transmission is aerosol, and that breathing reshared air even for a few secon…

When things don't make any sense, or show poor results, it's hard to comply to, which has been the case in the last two years with our betters on a power trip.

Re: Belgian scientific base in Antarctica engulfed by Covid despite strict measures

#242
post #54

Its almost like canceling all of humanity although it accomplishes extremely little but a CYA for the politicians is not the best way to handle this. Im sure when are fighting the 200th variant whose symptoms are a day of fatigue we will almost be ready to end the restrictions. And just for the record, im 2x vaccinated, not an antivaxxer or denier or something.

Why do you feel like you have to qualify your comment by disclosing your vaccination status? Surely that shouldn’t dictate whether you’re allowed to express your thoughts on a subject or the factual accuracy of your statements.

I agree.. but unfortunately nowadays we shove people who refuse or are skeptical about COVID vaccine in the "anti-vaxxer" basket so people have to clarify that

Re: Belgian scientific base in Antarctica engulfed by Covid despite strict measures

#243

Viruses are interesting things. I once enjoyed a case study about an outbreak of common cold on an Antarctic base that only happened after 17 weeks of isolation: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2130424/ (I'm no virologist but given that the common cold didn't seem to be impacted by the severe lockdowns in the UK at all, whereas flu was, I've gotten the - uneducated - feeling the cold is a bit like some S…

There is this old grandma theory that "don't run outside with wet hair, you'll catch a cold". Then we learned that viruses cannot spread like that, and so that old theory is basically invalid. But some time ago I read somewhere that this theory might still hold true somehow, because our nose stores all kinds of viruses, and they might burst out when we are weakened. Maybe someone more knowledgeable about this might c…

Isn't this how shingles / chickenpox works?

Re: Belgian scientific base in Antarctica engulfed by Covid despite strict measures

#244

Seems like a lot of testing and no quarantine before the departure and on the arrival. What can go wrong? Edit: I missed the 10 day quarantine in South Africa. So it is not so bad.

> All staff members preparing to depart to the station had to undergo a PCR test in Belgium two hours before leaving for South Africa, take a PCR test five days after their arrival in Cape Town, where they also had to quarantine for ten days. But of course, there could have been more quarantining.

[deleted]

Re: Belgian scientific base in Antarctica engulfed by Covid despite strict measures

#246
post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's 100% about hospital capacity and mass death. When hospitals around the country are no longer turning away cancer patients needing treatments and have plenty of ICUs for heart attacks and such, when they no longer have to rent fleets of refrigerator trucks every outbreak to store the bodies, the restrictions will end. It has always been about that and nothing more.

They could start by not terminating perfectly capable doctors and nurses who have decided, for whatever their reasons may be, to refuse vaccination. I’m vaccinated (and boosted) but I cannot understand why it was okay for these people to be on the frontlines of the fight for over a year but suddenly they are no longer acceptable. And I find no convincing argument as to why actually recovering from infection counts fo…

Those doctors and nurses are little more than saboteurs. Would you hire someone who would willingly increases their own risk of being unable to work by orders of magnitude for no actual gain?

Note that this is not like not hiring someone who likes to go mountain biking and therefore are more likely to hurt themselves and not work. Hobbies like that have real benefits. Vaccine denial not.

Re: Belgian scientific base in Antarctica engulfed by Covid despite strict measures

#247
post #240

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why is being bacterial count against it? Lyme and tb are bacterial also and known to do such a thing

I'm admittedly pretty out of my element here. Apologies if any of the following is misinformed. Lyme and TB are chronic symptoms, from what I understand. No truly dormant stages in the infection, just slight lulls in symptoms. I was under the impression that chronic viral infections such as herpes or HIV were much more able to pass under the immune system's radar for prolonged periods of time, with unpredictable flar…

No at least with TB most people will have a latent infection (no symptoms and not transmittable) present potentially for a lifetime just waiting for immune system to weaken enough

Re: Belgian scientific base in Antarctica engulfed by Covid despite strict measures

#248

Viruses are interesting things. I once enjoyed a case study about an outbreak of common cold on an Antarctic base that only happened after 17 weeks of isolation: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2130424/ (I'm no virologist but given that the common cold didn't seem to be impacted by the severe lockdowns in the UK at all, whereas flu was, I've gotten the - uneducated - feeling the cold is a bit like some S…

Could be someone was harboring some kind of cold virus and due to the stress of the environment—it had turned colder 4 days prior—the virus reemerged and became infectious. Another idea that's not mentioned in the article, but that might be possible, is that there was some dust that contained enough of some respiratory virus to be infectious, and due to the recent cold or just by chance, someone was digging through some supplies and breathed it in. Usually viruses degrade rapidly in the environment, since they have no metabolism to speak of to correct damage; I wonder, though, if enough could survive in a cold environment with limited or no sunlight, especially if it was in a storage area that had low relative humidity.

Critical part of the conclusion for those not wanting to skim the article:

> Virus might have persisted in the respiratory tract of one or more men at the Base. If such were the case it would be necessary to postulate a triggering mechanism to precipitate symptoms, and it is interesting to note that symptoms occurred 4 days after a precipitous fall in outside temperature, and during one of the coldest months of the year, which Hope-Simpson (1958) and Lidwell, Morgan & Williams (1965) have correlated with increased incidence of respiratory disease. There is disagreement about whether the viruses which cause common colds can be carried by adults, and how important this is in epidemiology. The pattern of virus infection revealed by long-term studies, such as the virus watch programme (Elveback et al. 1966), is of a series of short infections with different viruses, and in the case of influenza virus disappearance of the current strain when a new serotype appears. On the other hand, adenoviruses may be shed by children for periods of months and recove"ed from the tonsils in a high proportion of cases, without evidence of acute respiratory infection, and non-respiratory viruses such as those of the herpes group often persist for the lifetime of a man. Furthermore, observations in animals have shown that pigs can carry swine influenza and transmit infection to other pigs 3 months later (Blaskovic et al. 1970), turkeys may carry and shed influenza virus A after apparent recovery (Robinson, Easterday & Tumova, 1972), and cattle which have recovered from foot and mouth disease still reproduce virus in the pharynx, and can initiate epidemics on contact with non-immune cattle (Graves et al. 1971).

> There are thus precedents in both children and animals for persistence of respiratory viruses, but in adults the laboratory evidence for carriage and reactivation of common cold viruses is weak. It may be that such evidence can only be found in rather unusual conditions of isolation and stress, such as occur in Antarctica. It is likely to be a rare phenomenon, but it might well be important in explaining the persistence of the large number of rhinovirus serotypes which make an appearance in many areas when the temperature falls.

Re: Belgian scientific base in Antarctica engulfed by Covid despite strict measures

#249

Earlier quoted context omitted.

the strict health measures are the quarantines and consequences of testing. what happens if someone tests positive?

Seriously not impressed. Just spitballing here but to me strict health measures would be something like: 1. Here is the antiviral prophylactic we expect you to take starting X days before you depart and continuing until X days after you arrive. 2. Here is the shower at the entrance to the base that you must use before entering the base proper. 3. Here are the OTC meds or other protocols we expect to keep coughs and s…

You can clean the nasal passage with hydrogen peroxide but it’s not a nice thing to do.

Re: Belgian scientific base in Antarctica engulfed by Covid despite strict measures

#250

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Belgium actually had the first winter expedition to the Antarctic in the late 1800s. Although it was mostly Belgian in name only and also a complete disaster, save for a commendable amount of scientific data being collected. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Belgian_Antarctic_Expedition The book "Madhouse at the End of the Earth" by Julian Sancton is a great read for this story of the first humans to spend a sun-less w…

You wouldn't have more recommendations about this topic, would you?

The Shackleton expeditions saga for sure will give tons of reading.
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