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Girls perform better academically in almost all countries (2015)

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Re: Girls perform better academically in almost all countries (2015)

#241

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Perhaps a fourth explanation... The vast majority of teachers are female, so maybe their teaching methods are favorable to girls

I suppose this is possible - how exactly do you think teaching methods are more favorable to girls compared to boys?

You stated three possible reasons, I added a fourth possibility. My statement was a fact about correlation, not causation.

Perhaps you could provide us with some details about how education is not biased based on sex?

Re: Girls perform better academically in almost all countries (2015)

#242

How is it possible that girls perform better academically (in 2015) yet are under represented in the top tier of jobs? Either women have no interest in money, academic skills have no bearing in getting high paying jobs, or discrimination is more prevalent then you’d think. I suppose all three could be true.

I don't know if this is a good faith question, but the big obvious reason you've omitted is that women frequently drop out of the work force (or shift to part-time work) because they want to be directly involved in raising their children.

Societal expectations that women do child rearing rather than men probably has some impact on that decision.

Re: Girls perform better academically in almost all countries (2015)

#243

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Grades aren’t great at measuring real learning, but it’s the best we have.

Not really. I'd argue that standardized tests are much better than grades. Particularly for any grade level below university. At university level, the grades are more accurate (but still flawed) because the grade is typically 70-80% test and quiz based. My experience in the US with grades for middle school and high school is that it's 85-90% non-examination based-- Meaning it's essentially a measure for how well you…

Depends on the exam. If we're using something like the SAT or ACT, I can agree with that statement to an extent, but if it's a state exam, those are frequently flawed[1]. I think it's the best we can do though, since while people frequently bemoan any exam as testing one's ability to take exams, I've never seen a better alternative proposed.

[1]: https://www.miamiherald.com/news/local/education/article1952...

Re: Girls perform better academically in almost all countries (2015)

#244

Anyone with young boys and girls will notice that girls are much more likely to obey rules and instructions. A lot of doing well in school is about following rules and instructions, and it seems pretty natural that girls will do better. Also, most teachers are women. I haven't checked, but I'd assume most school administrators are women. It seems natural that they'd construct a system that's more suited for females t…

Do you think it has anything to do with girls having better handwriting. I couldn't improve my handwriting for the life of me when i was in school and got really poor grades from teachers not being able to read what i was writing.

Today, it's typing. I've seen the difference in kids. I think readability may be one issue, but perhaps even more important is that if writing is physically awkward and painful, it leads to writing fewer words and doing fewer edits.

My own experience was that learning to type, thanks to getting interested in programming, was game changing. All I can say is that I could write lengthy essays and reports in a jiffy. Still can.

Re: Girls perform better academically in almost all countries (2015)

#245

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Top tier jobs need to use top tier statistics. The top 10% of male test-takers and top 6% of female test-takers score at least 700 on the math SAT. Over twice as many boys as girls get 800 on the math SAT. The ratio gets even higher beyond that. This is despite the systemic bias in the school system against boys.

That's an interesting statistic. Do you have a source? I'd be interested in learning more

The first is from a table of percentiles published by the College Board, I remembered that statistic off-hand, I think you find it by googling, or on their website. The second is something you can find somewhere, I know I've seen the raw data at some point. Some googling will at least find articles referring to that ratio, like this one: https://economics.mit.edu/files/7598

Interestingly enough, that has a graph of the AMC math contest breakdown by sex. Check out page 7 (page number 115). When you start getting in the upper percentiles there I think that culture might magnify the male/female ratio a bit (this is based on personal experience), but at least in my high school the center mass of the scores up to 100+ or so was filled out by teachers just signing up a bunch of good students with no particular involvement in mathematical extracurriculars.

Re: Girls perform better academically in almost all countries (2015)

#247
post #210

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sorry, what? I gave an example of a teaching method which creates difficulties for boys relative to girls. You agreed boys have trouble with it. What is left to discuss?

Boys having trouble with a teaching method does not mean said teaching method is inherently discriminatory towards boys nor does it mean that its favorable towards girls. Do you not understand? I'm sorry if I'm not being clear. Nothing you have said has illustrated things being somehow favorable to girls. One group of individual doing better at something does not mean the thing is favorable towards the group.

The article is about girls outperforming relative to boys. In that context anything which penalises boys benefits girls, by definition. This is basic logic. I'm not sure what else can be said here, so let's leave it at that.

Re: Girls perform better academically in almost all countries (2015)

#248
post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure, but that's something most humans naturally want to do, even if they have no financial incentive. Most people don't like having to go to the office 8 hours a day, and very few probably would if money wasn't in the equation.

> Sure, but that's something most humans naturally want to do, I don't know that is true of most men. Have children? Sure. Raise them? Not so sure. I once read that men wanting to have more children is inversely proportional to the amount of work the mother expects them to contribute.

Men and women contribute to child rearing in different ways.

Women tend to be more nurturing so their role is disproportionately more important during a child's earlier formative years. They also tend to have a stronger orientation toward domestic affairs. Men, on the other hand, tend to be more strongly oriented toward the public sphere. The home is the focal point. Thus women are at the center of the action, as it were, when it comes to the amount of time they spend with children, while men tend to be more strongly motivated to take care of affairs for the sake of their families outside of the home. The home is also associated with greater safety and comfort, which is something women tend to prefer (we also see this reflected in occupational preferences), while the public sphere contains more risk and discomfort, something men prefer to face esp. when the reward is sufficiently high (this is also reflected in occupational preferences; men tend to prefer taking on more dangerous and higher stress jobs and longer hours in exchange for more pay).

I have used the word "tend" for a reason. These are not two sealed off magisteria. Proportion is probably good way to frame things, though to a point. So men also participate in child rearing, esp. where discipline is concerned (the complement of maternal nurturing is the need for paternal authority which serves the child later in other ways like the ability to relate to authority elsewhere in a healthy way). Women also operate in the public sphere and often also work. Conditions and circumstances can also constrain how male and female roles are expressed.

Re: Girls perform better academically in almost all countries (2015)

#250
post #155

Isn't this considered incorrect nowadays - to publicly generalize a superiority of a group of humans with dimension by race or gender?

I find your sentiment interesting, but we can't ignore a fact in favor of not hurting people's feelings. Of course, more research is always being done, so I'm sure in a few years a new research paper will come out and we will hear a different facts about a certain gender's academic performance. Then next big paper comes out and the cycle repeats. That's just my two cents anyways.

Have you been living in a cave for the past 10 years?
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