Modi government to set up app store alternative to Google Play, Apple App Store • Hacker News Board

Re: Modi government to set up app store alternative to Google Play, Apple App Store

#241

Post by ramshanker » Sat, Oct 03, 2020, 6:42 PM UTC

>>>>Also, talks within the government indicate that it may ask Google and Apple to pre-install Indian App Store in all phones sold in India in near future. This particular request is likely to face counter from the American companies. THIS is the only time, I am more inclined to side with Chinese style of control. Sovereign nation out to decide what is good for their people. India is a chaotic democracy, but a function one. I will rather support my government's way of ensuring "Privacy and Security" than Apple's. We do have equally capable people over here. Slowly but surely, things move in positive direction. No need of dictation by any foreign multi-national.

The way Google banned PayTM for few hours, until they removed some of the features from the App, come-on, Indian Laws are good enough to decide what is legal / correct / etc. etc. This was a very visible case of an American company imposing "Their Policy" on things which only court / government should get to decide.

I am mostly IN with this proposal.

EDIT: I guess I used harsh words, but something definitely needs to be done with the current duopoly.

Re: Modi government to set up app store alternative to Google Play, Apple App Store

#242

Post by IshKebab » Sat, Oct 03, 2020, 6:50 PM UTC

toast0 wrote: post #214

IshKebab wrote: post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

* You can use all the device APIs, not just the ones that have been exposed as web APIs. * They're way faster and less janky. * You don't to use endless workarounds to disable typical web behaviour when you don't want it. PWAs are probably suitable for basic apps that just display information, e.g. an app for an event, or a pub or whatever. You would be insane to try and make a "real" app like Snapchat or Google Maps…

Google's Android UI toolkit is slower than Chrome building UI from HTML, sadly. So it's not a clear win for native apps (unless the native app is using HTML for UI, I guess). That said, I don't think PWAs have a good way to get background data updates, which is unfortunate for apps that could work offline. You can't do a silent push to update data, last I checked, anyway. (Use case: I want a weather app that has curr…

You mean slower to write? You're probably right for native Android. But I didn't say anything about development effort. Also it's definitely easier to get polished apps with Flutter than PWAs, so I think they'd still lose on that front.

Re: Modi government to set up app store alternative to Google Play, Apple App Store

#243

Post by Bodhisattya » Sat, Oct 03, 2020, 6:59 PM UTC

actuator wrote: post #97

diego_moita wrote: post #56

I welcome this. It will be messy, it will open oportunities to corruption, lobbying, crappy user experiences, unsafe apps, government abuse, nationalism, ... it is really a Pandora box. But mess can be a fertile ground for competition and innovation when excessive regulation blocks it. Today's app stores are just feature development labs for Apple & Google. There is no chance that anyone will be able to create a big…

I am just puzzled about one bit of this, why the hue and cry few days back about this. Don't Android App stores like the Amazon one already exist? What's stopping these devs to even distribute the apps themselves? iOS is a different matter but Android has always allowed this. Not sure if they exist in India, but I have seen Android phones come with non Google App Store as well.

I would say that the government is not the right institution to take this up. They should support secondary app stores, or legislate to force Apple and Google to make their stores more developer friendly. Getting involved in this business, goes against their own narrative. On one hand, we are privatizing state owned companies and on the other, we are taking up vanity projects which the tax payer has to fund. Do check up on our new government building, that no one apart from the powers that be asked for. Also, this announcement very much coincided with an attempt from some of the major apps in introducing a form of sports betting (see IPL), which was thwarted by the very same Google and Apple, in line with the laws of our country. All over, it seems like American tech. giants are more pro-indian-consumer than our own government, which is tremendously dissappointing in and of itself.

Re: Modi government to set up app store alternative to Google Play, Apple App Store

#244

Post by zepto » Sat, Oct 03, 2020, 7:07 PM UTC

bilbo0s wrote: post #236

zepto wrote: post #231

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What choice? All of these are mandatory.

Yeah, I'm not sure a lot of people see what's about to happen here. Many here seem to believe this will open up opportunities for them to start app stores. It won't. It will open up opportunities for governments around the world to do what they've been contemplating for a long time. Part of which is to specifically preclude you from opening an app store in their jurisdiction.

Right - we currently have a quasi duopoly which frankly won’t last a decade if people are willing to compete with it. Both companies are showing signs of ossification.

If governments get involved, we’ll have a government monopoly and government regulated software sales forever.

Re: Modi government to set up app store alternative to Google Play, Apple App Store

#245

Post by toast0 » Sat, Oct 03, 2020, 7:16 PM UTC

IshKebab wrote: post #242

toast0 wrote: post #214

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Google's Android UI toolkit is slower than Chrome building UI from HTML, sadly. So it's not a clear win for native apps (unless the native app is using HTML for UI, I guess). That said, I don't think PWAs have a good way to get background data updates, which is unfortunate for apps that could work offline. You can't do a silent push to update data, last I checked, anyway. (Use case: I want a weather app that has curr…

You mean slower to write? You're probably right for native Android. But I didn't say anything about development effort. Also it's definitely easier to get polished apps with Flutter than PWAs, so I think they'd still lose on that front.

No, I mean slower to run. It takes way too long for widget objects to be created, and you can only do it on the UI Thread, and you have to make most of your widgets when the app opens (otherwise there's nothing to see).

It was also slower to write for me, but I've never had a good time understanding UI toolkits, so I assume that's my own character flaw.

Re: Modi government to set up app store alternative to Google Play, Apple App Store

#246

Post by uname_amiy » Sat, Oct 03, 2020, 7:22 PM UTC

Considering what the central government said back in 2017[1] >"There is no fundamental right to privacy and even if it is assumed as a fundamental right, it is multifaceted. Every facet can’t be ipso facto considered a fundamental right."

This doesn't sound like a good idea to give the control of an app store to the government. Government will for sure try to track and spy on users and remove any app it doesn't like and quality will be a joke.

[1]: https://www.thehindu.com/news/national/right-to-privacy-not-...

Re: Modi government to set up app store alternative to Google Play, Apple App Store

#247

Post by tssva » Sat, Oct 03, 2020, 7:29 PM UTC

pedro_hab wrote: post #124

tssva wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Corporations did just that in the specific part of the world under discussion here. I suggest you look into the East India Trading Company, Dutch East India and French East India companies.

I didn't say corporations are all good, but the fact that you had to go back to the 17th century to find an example tells a lot. Governments have been killing people since their beginning and probably as we speak.

I didn't need to go back to the 17th century but it seemed an appropriate example given the part of the world under discussion.

Re: Modi government to set up app store alternative to Google Play, Apple App Store

#248

Post by notsureaboutpg » Sat, Oct 03, 2020, 7:33 PM UTC

_throwaway_0093 wrote: post #187

anaganisk wrote: post #142

Modi is a pure marketing person representing JIO and PayTM period, he just wants their spyware to be pre-installed. Nothing more, now if you want proof, watch the down votes. He is the kind of PM who doesn't meet journalists, doesn't take questions. And all he does is Marketing. No execution went atleast good till now.

I have to explain this comment. Because it will look like politically charged content to outsiders. The following is a rough summary of Indian politics from my perspective: The current leadership has done some fishy marketing tactics for sure. There are swathes of fake news on whatsapp and Facebook which lure unsuspecting citizens into thinking the current leadership is some kind of savior. The local media is mostly…

[dead]

Re: Modi government to set up app store alternative to Google Play, Apple App Store

#249

Post by airocker » Sat, Oct 03, 2020, 7:33 PM UTC

rishav_sharan wrote: post #163

Far too many optimistic voices here and that scares me. I don't see this app store being about providing alternatives. that's just a talking point. This app store is all about forcing every android sold in India to have a system installed govt driven app, which will report back to the govt on tons of private information about the device and owner. Information that Indian govt will be too incompetent to keep safe and…

Privacy and Freedom are the same thing. If you dont have privacy, you cannot do anything as a group or individual that goes against anyone powerful. Freedom can also be thought of as sovereignty. I think if any government including USA has to be sovereign, it has to take privacy of citizens in its own hands. Democratic countries have to devise ways that this data cannot be used to influence elections. Otherwise, Keep in mind Google is no democracy. This data cannot be better off with a corporation because they maintain their database security better.

Re: Modi government to set up app store alternative to Google Play, Apple App Store

#250

Post by atombender » Sat, Oct 03, 2020, 7:40 PM UTC

oauea wrote: post #223

ffpip wrote: post #220

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not about selling your store activity. The apps on these stores do not comply with basic guideline like having a privacy policy, not forcing users to give access to all permissions, etc.

So just don't install them. You can make these decisions yourself, you don't need Apple to make them for you.

The problem is transparency — nobody has perfect information about what apps do. People on HN will be better informed than most, but do you think your mom or dad will know not to install certain apps that might be widely known (except to them) to be predatory? What about malicious apps that, say, steal credit card information?