Live data from Hacker News

Trump’s WeChat curbs halted by judge on free speech concerns

bloomberg.com

241–250 of 401 posts

Re: Trump’s WeChat curbs halted by judge on free speech concerns

#241

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"The difference between TikTok and WeChat and FB/Google/Twitter is obvious: the former are to some degree controlled by China and the latter are private entities." I think that difference is not that wide as people believe. Throwing money into advertising on any platform will get you close or beyond ideological subversion or active measures. All you have to do is look at the radicalization and the polarization of lef…

I agree, these are problems. But at least in the US we can continue to pass legislation as we learn more about how to properly regulate these platforms It is much easier to enforce laws on a US-based company than a foreign one.

> But at least in the US we can continue to pass legislation as we learn more about how to properly regulate these platforms

Continue is the wrong word. Nothing is done by legislation or these companies themselves to properly regulate these platforms.

There is also nothing preventing foreign influence on U.S.-based company platforms, which is already happening, and has been happening, unchecked.

I have used WeChat daily for over three years. There is not a single instance in which I have been unduly influenced. I use it to message, video chat, and pay for things. That simply is not true for YouTube, Twitter, Google, Apple, etc. I can't even go to YouTube without having unremovable, unhidable ads for Trump. We also have a situation where the sitting president has rented out the YouTube homepage for an entire week prior to the election. It's naivety, and frankly delusional, to think the U.S. is somehow at threat by WeChat and not the multitude of sly behavior going on with U.S.-based companies.

U.S.-based companies and culture have long been driven by highly concentrated special interest groups, from Hollywood to Wall Street to Silicon Valley, and all of this amounts to undue influence and control upon the American people, who have been manipulated into playing the game.

Re: Trump’s WeChat curbs halted by judge on free speech concerns

#242

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"The difference between TikTok and WeChat and FB/Google/Twitter is obvious: the former are to some degree controlled by China and the latter are private entities." I think that difference is not that wide as people believe. Throwing money into advertising on any platform will get you close or beyond ideological subversion or active measures. All you have to do is look at the radicalization and the polarization of lef…

With chat programs, the concern is over monitoring. The US can issue warrants to get your chat records from Messenger/Hangouts. Those warrants are obtained a bit too easily due to FISA/Security Letters, but that's another due process issue/policy issue. With Chinese companies, they don't even need the illusion of warrants or due process. FB/Twitter/Tiktok are different because they control WHAT you see. None of them…

Tencent/WeChat also control what you see in your feeds. I often notice when I share information/pictures related to Hong Kong/Xinjiang then my posts doesn’t always appear in my friends feeds (because the image hash/phrase cause the post to be shadowbanned). Their approach is quite evil because it will make you think people might not like your post (since they don’t “like” it) when in fact they simply can’t see it.

To bypass the filter then I slightly modify images to change their hash, or record video of the video/image/text. Maybe soon they’ll start making fake likes from friends so that people can’t use inactivity as a way of detecting shadowbans, or maybe they’ll make the posts only visible to a small subset of friends.

Re: Trump’s WeChat curbs halted by judge on free speech concerns

#243
post #238

From the beginning of this I never understood how there could be any legal basis whatsoever for the ban. Apparently that's because there was none.

So a federal judge blocks something based on their opinion/interpretation and you interpret that as something having "no legal basis whatsoever"? You look at life through an interesting lens...

> So a federal judge blocks something based on their opinion/interpretation and you interpret that as something having "no legal basis whatsoever"

Given that a federal judge's ruling is the textbook definition of a legal basis...yeah? At least until it goes to a higher court.

Re: Trump’s WeChat curbs halted by judge on free speech concerns

#244
Heaven forbid we treat Chinese businesses the same way they treat our businesses in China. You assholes want us to operate without reciprocity at a disadvantage to China and their behaviors because “China.” It’s gets really old. You accept their controls as the nature of affairs but demand we hold ourselves to a different standard.

Re: Trump’s WeChat curbs halted by judge on free speech concerns

#245

All sovereign nations reserve the right to regulate foreign goods, vessels, diplomats, currency, and peoples distinctly from their native counterparts. Apps are truly no different.

What a sovereign nation, as an abstract entity, can do, is distinct from what its executive leader can do. The only time they happen to coincide is, by definition, in the case of autocracy.

Aka China?! It’s called reciprocity dumb ass.

Re: Trump’s WeChat curbs halted by judge on free speech concerns

#246

Honest question for Chinese users of WeChat: have you ever thought twice about WeChat posts and communications, whether they'll be deemed "acceptable" to censors? Everyone I know self-censors nearly constantly, if unconsciously. A good example: in a discussion of this case I was reading today in Chinese the author ironically noted that he couldn't summarize the US government's position because in a large WeChat group…

No. I need it to conduct business, and that's more important to me than posting or discussing controversial topics. People in China literally do not use email, so this is the only effective method to get things done (which I'm totally ok with!). This ban would be an absolute disaster for me, given that my entire rolodex are WeChat contacts, not email addresses. I also feel for my friends who have family in China, and…

The average American has no idea how disruptive this is to the Chinese American community; as you stated they basically do not use email, and this is essentially the only way to communicate to friends and family in China. I know a lot of older Chinese Americans who were freaking out for weeks because banning this app would essentially cut them off with no clear alternatives.

As to the censorship point, from my experience using wechat in the past people rarely discuss politics on there, unless it's to make fun of the US political reality TV. Perhaps not actively discussing internal Chinese politics is considered a form of self-censorship.

Re: Trump’s WeChat curbs halted by judge on free speech concerns

#247

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They can do what all expats in China already need to do to access facebook, google, gmail, instagram, twitter, whatsapp, etc: use a vpn.

Just to be clear, the USA doesn’t have the infrastructure or legal framework in place to actually block internet traffic. The best they can do is remove DNS entries.

I've read somewhere that they can force the ISPs to ban wechat traffic? I'm not in IT so is this just complete hogwash?

Re: Trump’s WeChat curbs halted by judge on free speech concerns

#248

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Please. At this point, both blacks and Indians are able to take various Federal and State monies to be the best they can be. The Indians have relative sovereignty. They could take their federal and casino monies and plow them into an R&D bonanza. Blacks in the US have a golden ticket to pretty much any institution they wish to attend. Both have had trillions of US dollars plowed into their communities over the year v…

My parents were in high school while segregation still existed. There's no question they got opportunities many black americans the same age did not, which absolutely had a direct and significant impact on my life. Redlining remained legal into the 70s, and was continued with the thinnest of fig leafs concealing it into the 90s. Covert discrimination in loan and rental applications continues to this day. Many studies…

You called me a bigot. I can’t respond. I’m stuck. Nowhere to go.

Native Americans can invest in themselves. When they take the patrimony of the Federal government, they don’t. https://youtu.be/pQ4lnDy2xnQ

The same is true of the blacks. Before LBJ decimated them, they were on their way to be independent. They were starting to make money equal to whites. They were establishing their own cities with arts like Harlem. Then the Democrats came in offering free government money. The women just had to kick out their men to get it. They should also pursue abortions since that was empowering. Now blacks have stayed at 13% of the population for decades. They are impoverished. They believe they are victims.

But I a person that won’t vote Democrat because of this and continuing evil. I am the bigot. Ok. I’ll take that title. I am a bigot for knowing that blacks can govern their own destiny without the white man from the Federal government. The same for natives.

Re: Trump’s WeChat curbs halted by judge on free speech concerns

#249

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My parents were in high school while segregation still existed. There's no question they got opportunities many black americans the same age did not, which absolutely had a direct and significant impact on my life. Redlining remained legal into the 70s, and was continued with the thinnest of fig leafs concealing it into the 90s. Covert discrimination in loan and rental applications continues to this day. Many studies…

You called me a bigot. I can’t respond. I’m stuck. Nowhere to go. Native Americans can invest in themselves. When they take the patrimony of the Federal government, they don’t. https://youtu.be/pQ4lnDy2xnQ The same is true of the blacks. Before LBJ decimated them, they were on their way to be independent. They were starting to make money equal to whites. They were establishing their own cities with arts like Harlem.…

Wow. At least you're saying the quiet parts loud and clear now.

Re: Trump’s WeChat curbs halted by judge on free speech concerns

#250
post #26

By far the most egregious overreach of Federal authority in recent memory. Noting about this is reasonable. Its 100% the act of a desperate and weak minded despot who knows nothing about technology but acts out of ignorance and pettiness. A truly illegal and Anti-American act.

Please don't post political flamewar rants to HN, regardless of how right you are or feel you are. It leads to more predictable and usually nastier discussion.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Post reply on HN