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America’s Professional Elite: Wealthy, Successful and Miserable

nytimes.com

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Re: America’s Professional Elite: Wealthy, Successful and Miserable

#241

Post by zolthrowaway »

nimonian wrote: post #136
Murdoch wrote: post #17

The rich are depressed, the middle-class is shrinking and fearful, the poor are hopeless. I'm gonna take a leap here and say maybe people need some religion in their lives to give direction and meaning. I found it interesting that a person in the article who made $1.2M a year was still depressed in thinking they were wasting their lives and it was all meaningless. I ask myself, does this person have children? a famil…

> maybe people need some religion in their lives to give direction and meaning I can't just accept dogma because I'm miserable. I can't just say 2+2=5 even if it would make me feel better. Religion isn't something you can just pick up like pilates. If life is inherently without meaning or direction, I'd rather go with that and be true to myself than refract the universe through some doctrine I understand to be false.…

You're right that you can't just dive head first into a religion. I was raised Catholic, but I don't identify with that at all anymore. I was atheist for a few years, but recently I've been reading Tao Te Ching and I've really taken to it. Religions don't have to be western and you don't have to believe in some omnipotent, omniscient, omnibenevolent creator. It might be worth exploring some "religions" that you've never thought about before. I'm not saying they're going to cure your depression, but they may change how you see the world.

Re: America’s Professional Elite: Wealthy, Successful and Miserable

#242

Post by throwaway-1283 »

kurthr wrote: post #99
naravara wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>what world are these people living in that you can't give up a job that you hate because you can't afford to live on 500-600k. The one where you lock into a mortgage and a car that assumes a $1.2M salary to keep ahead of. It's really easy to let your lifestyle expenses balloon, especially in a high-COL city where minor increases in living space/amenities can end up costing large amounts of money.

Yeah... I literally don't buy it. High Cost of Living city has nothing to do with needing $500k/yr in earnings (post tax). What kind of mortgage and car do you have that? Simple answer... that's a $10M house or a $2M car or half of each of those. Besides the fact that if you're earning $1.2M salary, you're taking home other bonus/stock that are comparable. Getting locked into this sort of lifestyle is a choice not dr…

Usually when someone mentions a salary figure it's pre-tax. $500k in NYC is ~285k post-tax.

If you have a family, a $1.5m house (which barely gets you a shabby 3-bedroom in a high cost city) will, assuming you put $300k down, be around $8-$10k/month in mortgage + property taxes + insurance + any hoa/maintenence, which is by itself 40% of your monthly take home.

Re: America’s Professional Elite: Wealthy, Successful and Miserable

#243

Post by snarf21 »

graeme wrote: post #85

Statistics about income not making people happy are common. I wonder how wealth/savings affects it. If the $1.2 million worker hadn't inflated his lifestyle, he'd be free to take any job he wanted, or even perform his own job the way he thought best, safe in the knowledge that he would be financially fine if let go. It seems that a lot of people who reach high incomes never maintain slack in their lives. As much as p…

Most things I have read previously showed that more money generally only makes people happier up to a certain point, somewhere around $80K. At this level it is possible (in most places) to not live paycheck to paycheck and have some savings and financial security. Above this level, nothing really changes except how expensive our things are.

Find meaning in your hobby or in your volunteering or your exploration of nature, not your work or your income bracket.

Re: America’s Professional Elite: Wealthy, Successful and Miserable

#244

Post by ryanburk »

vasilipupkin wrote: post #183
zhobbs wrote: post #163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"According to Census data, the median household income in Palo Alto is $137,000 a year, while the US average is $57,600" from: https://www.cnet.com/news/silicon-valley-middle-class-earns-...

I think this type of Census data understates household incomes. I am not exactly sure why, but Atherton comes in at about 400k a year per household. That is a lot, but doesn't seem like a lot for Atherton.

I believe it is skewed since many people in these neighborhoods aren't making their money through salary income (anymore), but instead through interest / dividends.

If you sold your company, aren't working at FB/goog/etc and are sitting on a ton of stock holdings, your income is going to show as near $0

Re: America’s Professional Elite: Wealthy, Successful and Miserable

#245

Post by vonmoltke »

maps wrote: post #215
kurthr wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I assume you're being sarcastic... a $15M shithole apartment! X^D

Yeah looks like I obviously touched a nerve with some people here I guess?

You didn't touch a nerve. You're out in bizzaro-land. $15MM in Manhattan will get you a brownstone on the Upper West Side.

Re: America’s Professional Elite: Wealthy, Successful and Miserable

#246

Post by kevin_thibedeau »

vasilipupkin wrote: post #191
JackFr wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Let's say you've got three kids and you're living on the Upper East Side of Manhattan. Your mortgage and maintenance for a 3 bedroom apartment at $3.5MM are going to be ~15000 a month or 180K a year. Three private school tuitions are 150K. Living in NYC you're paying NYC, NYS and Federal income taxes for probably the highest tax rate in the country. So basically it's easy to be paycheck to paycheck on 500K in NYC.

a problem easily solvable by a move to NJ, which of course, would dramatically increase your misery level. In fact, that's probably why that guy is miserable - he doesn't live in Manhattan and has a 2 hr or more commute every day.

There are plenty of wealthy people living a comfortable lifestyle in rich communities off the Palisades pkwy. with a 20 minute hop into the city. 15 if you drive at entitled speeds.

Re: America’s Professional Elite: Wealthy, Successful and Miserable

#247

Post by seppin »

cryptica wrote: post #235

>> If you spend 12 hours a day doing work you hate, at some point it doesn’t matter what your paycheck says Bullshit. If someone earns $1.2 million per year, they can retire after 2 or 3 years. They have no right to complain. They're weak. $1.2 million is the definition of eternal happiness. If you earn that, whatever emotion you feel in your life is called happiness. This emotion which their greedy brains interpret…

> Bullshit. If someone earns $1.2 million per year, they can retire after 2 or 3 years. They have no right to complain. They're weak.

that's the point, lifestyle creep means you hang out only with people that earn that too. it becomes normal, average even. and you can't dare step away

Re: America’s Professional Elite: Wealthy, Successful and Miserable

#248

Post by eclipxe »

leroy_masochist wrote: post #238
mrfredward wrote: post #165

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The median income for NYC is $57,000. Surely 10X what a typical person makes is enough for a family to get by, it's just not enough for the lifestyle they want. Source: https://www.census.gov/quickfacts/fact/table/newyorkcitynewy...

You are correct, but if this guy's an HBS alum pulling in 7 figures on the buy side, then he and his family are living the Upper East Side lifestyle which means: Private school tuition - $50k/kid/year Additional activities such as tutoring, sports, etc - $10-20k/kid/year Mortgages+fees or rent for a 1,500 square foot apartment in a doorman building in East 80's - $75,000-150,000/year Mortgage or rent for country home…

This guy NYCs

Re: America’s Professional Elite: Wealthy, Successful and Miserable

#249

Post by graeme »

snarf21 wrote: post #243
graeme wrote: post #85

Statistics about income not making people happy are common. I wonder how wealth/savings affects it. If the $1.2 million worker hadn't inflated his lifestyle, he'd be free to take any job he wanted, or even perform his own job the way he thought best, safe in the knowledge that he would be financially fine if let go. It seems that a lot of people who reach high incomes never maintain slack in their lives. As much as p…

Most things I have read previously showed that more money generally only makes people happier up to a certain point, somewhere around $80K. At this level it is possible (in most places) to not live paycheck to paycheck and have some savings and financial security. Above this level, nothing really changes except how expensive our things are. Find meaning in your hobby or in your volunteering or your exploration of nat…

Yeah that's what I'm referencing. I'm just wondering if there'd be any difference if they measured wealth/surplus income. Like, is someone with a $40,000/year lifestyle happier with $150,000 salary than $80,000?

If you have that kind of surplus you experience a great freedom. You can seek a better job, you can retire early, etc

Re: America’s Professional Elite: Wealthy, Successful and Miserable

#250

Post by eclipxe »

seveneightn9ne wrote: post #179
minikites wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't understand the mindset of burning yourself out in middle age so you can "enjoy the world" when you're much more likely to be frail and have serious health problems that prevent you from participating in many activities.

If you make 1.2 million a year you could literally retire after 1-2 years and live comfortably (on ~40k) for the rest of your life. Want to live on 100k? Only takes 4 years.

Taxes.
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