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Harvard discrimination lawsuit: data show penalization of Asian-Americans

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Re: Harvard discrimination lawsuit: data show penalization of Asian-Americans

#241

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Lawsuits like this, I'd imagine. Also, waaaaaay more asians need to be running for Congress. It's getting better but they're still underrepresented slightly (4.8% of reps are asian while 5.6% of americans are).

Asians evidently are too smart to want to get involved in politics. Gotta respect that. (not joking)

But Jews aren't?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Jewish_American_politi...

3/9 of the Supreme Court Justices are listed as Jewish.

Not sure what your argument is. The definition of "smartness" seems to be very subjective in this case.

Re: Harvard discrimination lawsuit: data show penalization of Asian-Americans

#242
post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because we must assume black people are intrinsically just as capable as white people, the goal must be to drive that disparity to zero. Must we? There's another comment here about no one seeming too bothered that the NBA doesn't contain very many Asians. Is it already too racist to believe that there are certainly trends in race, and that everyone is different and should be considered on their individual merits alon…

If you take the time to read real history written by highly educated and thoughtful scholars (as opposed to bs pseudo intellectual history) then yes. Just think about the racist stereotypes held by Americans towards Chinese and Japanese people during and prior to WWII. Those stereotypes were not of the successful violin playing overachiever, I can promise you that. Thus, for anyone willing to look in the mirror, all…

A "devil's advocate" can refute that by either narrowing or broadening the scope to great individuals/civilizations.

When was the last time you heard about african Nobel prize winners? Or african artists/composers? African philosophers or generals?

The asians have Confucius, Sun Tzu, etc. speak for them.

Whom do the africans have?

Re: Harvard discrimination lawsuit: data show penalization of Asian-Americans

#243

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ofcourse all types of people are likely intrinsically pretty close to everyone else, but you can't underestimate the effect of culture. Roughly speaking, alcohol is legal worldwide if you're above the age of 18 or so. So why do alcoholism rates vary massively between countries? It's largely 'culture'. Black american culture has been pretty self-destructive these last hundred years. Look at rap music videos, thug cult…

>Black american culture has been pretty self-destructive these last hundred years. This is entirely your own subjective opinion and a very racist one. Except you can provide definite proof that show that rap music, jazz music etc somehow lead to 'self-destruction' (or even that single motherhood is some deliberate part of the culture) all you're doing is revealing your personal dislikes and biases. It is also a very…

The four cornerstones of gangsta rap music (seemingly the dominant subset of it) are:

1)Prostitutes (And pimps and promiscuous sex and STDs that go along with that)

2)Guns (And you can bet those aren't being used for self-defense against wild animals when you travel to your remote cabin in the woods for a weekend)

3)Drugs (These are self-evidently bad, so no need to elaborate)

4)Money (Often obtained as a result of illegal use/exploitation of some or all of the above)

And even absent all that you can often hear lyrics about the performer singing about how he (or the song's protagonist) "couldn't make it in a white man's world": Afroman - Palmdale.

That type of depressive, often criminal culture seems to fit the description of "self-destruction".

> no one conflates the behavior of say redneck Americans or free love hippies with the self-destructive culture of white America.

Neither rednecks nor hippies have any significant influence on how an average white american behaves. Most people would struggle to name any names.

Yet it's trivial for people to name a few prominent gangsta rappers. Heck, those who achieved cult status were shot in mid 90s.

Re: Harvard discrimination lawsuit: data show penalization of Asian-Americans

#244

I'm a Chinese American and I have experienced this type of behavior during the college admissions process, and during the hiring process with larger companies. During the college applications process, I noticed I was receiving vastly different responses than my girlfriend (wife now) who was African American. Perhaps you could chalk it up recommendations or personal projects. But my girlfriend and I were both A studen…

I was an ivy league admissions officer for a few years after college. I promise you your application was viewed as "well, here's another really smart asian kid who's otherwise unremarkable from the other 1000 we'll see". Meanwhile, hers was treated like precious gold.

"well, here's another really smart asian kid who's otherwise unremarkable from the other 1000 we'll see"

Why doesn't this apply to Jewish people, who are far more overrepresented than asians?

Re: Harvard discrimination lawsuit: data show penalization of Asian-Americans

#245

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Honest question... what's the problem with Asian? I'm not Asian, but, if their applications were best, I wouldn't be offended if the entire student body was Asian.

Like I said, it's not a race thing, its that a lot of the asian applicants all basically look the same on paper and have the same stated goals. Lots of white kids apply with the same "look" and also get rejected. Those students are not seen as bringing enough to the table.

And this process just happens to create numbers that look exactly like a racial quota... yeah right. If you did blinded admissions the numbers wouldn't look the same at all.

Re: Harvard discrimination lawsuit: data show penalization of Asian-Americans

#246

This shows everything what is wrong witg race quotas. They are racist in it's core. It also mocks the idea that underpreformence of certian ethnic grups is because of "racism" and "white privilege".

jewish privilege is a much more serious problem than white privilege

Re: Harvard discrimination lawsuit: data show penalization of Asian-Americans

#247
post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Race blindness isn’t the end goal, the goal is racial equality. Today, black people on average make 1/3 less income than white people. Because we must assume black people are intrinsically just as capable as white people, the goal must be to drive that disparity to zero. With that in mind, it makes no sense from a scientific/engineering perspective to ignore race. No scientist or engineer looks at a situation, sees a…

Because we must assume black people are intrinsically just as capable as white people, the goal must be to drive that disparity to zero. Must we? There's another comment here about no one seeming too bothered that the NBA doesn't contain very many Asians. Is it already too racist to believe that there are certainly trends in race, and that everyone is different and should be considered on their individual merits alon…

The thing is I know you mean well, and we need more people who are willing to express opinions like this so there can be honest dialogue. Then, people like me can come along and say "that is just so terribly misguided and simplistic"!

First, to throw out comparisons between two "groups" with completely different histories results in facile conclusions and fallacious attributions of causation (i.e. just like yours). Second, the idea that African Americans or Asians each represent a homegeneous group is just incorrect. Third, you don't account for billions of impoverished Asians who have not cleared that high-bar. Indeed, those who make it to Western nations like the U.S. are exceptional by definition.

Likewise, you talk about blacks needing a higher bar to clear as if slavery, Jim Crow, ongoing biases, misconceptions (i.e. like yours here) and outright discrimination aren't high enough. Indeed, by any reasonable acknowledgement of history, African Americans should be extinct. Yet, many are actually thriving. That is self-determination and "bar-clearing" that rivals or exceeds just about anything you can find in this country.

Remember, we're only ~150 years outside of slavery. There are people alive today whose lifespans overlap with those of formerly enslaved family members. And, of course, there are many alive today who lived through Jim Crow--that is codified discrimination. And, implicit and explicit biases are still rampant. Does that give you any sense of irony for suggesting that African Americans simply need a higher bar to clear?

Please stop comparing the African Americans who are struggling most with the exceptional Asians (or others) who have made it to American shores. Please expand your understanding of the real challenges that African Americans have historically faced and continue to face and reckon with the astounding achievements they have realized in spite of this.

Re: Harvard discrimination lawsuit: data show penalization of Asian-Americans

#248
post #243

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Black american culture has been pretty self-destructive these last hundred years. This is entirely your own subjective opinion and a very racist one. Except you can provide definite proof that show that rap music, jazz music etc somehow lead to 'self-destruction' (or even that single motherhood is some deliberate part of the culture) all you're doing is revealing your personal dislikes and biases. It is also a very…

The four cornerstones of gangsta rap music (seemingly the dominant subset of it) are: 1)Prostitutes (And pimps and promiscuous sex and STDs that go along with that) 2)Guns (And you can bet those aren't being used for self-defense against wild animals when you travel to your remote cabin in the woods for a weekend) 3)Drugs (These are self-evidently bad, so no need to elaborate) 4)Money (Often obtained as a result of i…

>Neither rednecks nor hippies have any significant influence on how an average white american behaves

Meanwhile uber-violent and hyper-sexualized mass-market movies, outright pornography, and death metal are largely produced by white people/entities. Should we discuss the influence they have on how ”average american whites” behave? For that matter, much of "gangsta rap" has been produced by white-owned entities.

In short, you provided the "four cornerstones of gangsta rap music". For each, we could just as easily plug in widely consumed, top-grossing films or other products of "white culture".

Meanwhile, back in the real-world, mass shootings seem to be the near-exclusive purview of white men. Shall we also opine on the destructiveness of white culture based on that?

The point is that racist generalizations don't help anyone.

Re: Harvard discrimination lawsuit: data show penalization of Asian-Americans

#249
post #242
post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you take the time to read real history written by highly educated and thoughtful scholars (as opposed to bs pseudo intellectual history) then yes. Just think about the racist stereotypes held by Americans towards Chinese and Japanese people during and prior to WWII. Those stereotypes were not of the successful violin playing overachiever, I can promise you that. Thus, for anyone willing to look in the mirror, all…

A "devil's advocate" can refute that by either narrowing or broadening the scope to great individuals/civilizations. When was the last time you heard about african Nobel prize winners? Or african artists/composers? African philosophers or generals? The asians have Confucius, Sun Tzu, etc. speak for them. Whom do the africans have?

You asked "when was the last time..." for Africans as if you were referring to recent history, then went back to Confucius and Sun Tzu for Asians?

That's pretty funny. So, are you including Ancient Egypt for Africa or only later? Because, as you know, so much is derivative of that civilization.

Otherwise, slightly more recently, do Shaka Zulu, Ras Mengesha Yohannes, and Tariq ibn Ziyad, count for generals? How about Mandela, Soyinka, and Tutu for Nobel prize winners?

And, of course, for more fun we can reference other categories of "achievement", the value of which is culture-specific, then ask which other cultures have matched those "achievements".

Re: Harvard discrimination lawsuit: data show penalization of Asian-Americans

#250
post #243

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The four cornerstones of gangsta rap music (seemingly the dominant subset of it) are: 1)Prostitutes (And pimps and promiscuous sex and STDs that go along with that) 2)Guns (And you can bet those aren't being used for self-defense against wild animals when you travel to your remote cabin in the woods for a weekend) 3)Drugs (These are self-evidently bad, so no need to elaborate) 4)Money (Often obtained as a result of i…

> Neither rednecks nor hippies have any significant influence on how an average white american behaves Meanwhile uber-violent and hyper-sexualized mass-market movies, outright pornography, and death metal are largely produced by white people/entities. Should we discuss the influence they have on how ”average american whites” behave? For that matter, much of "gangsta rap" has been produced by white-owned entities. In…

Mass shootings are insignificant in the total amount of shootings.

http://www.gunpolicy.org/firearms/region/united-states

2016: 38,658 2015: 36,247 2014: 33,599 2013: 33,636 2012: 33,563 2011: 32,351 2010: 31,672 2009: 31,347 2008: 31,593

Which year have mass shootings by whites amounted to at least 1% of total gun deaths?

As for Death Metal bands, how many of the performers in this genre have been arrested for gun-related crimes?

How many were killed by guns and went on to achieve cult status?

> are largely produced by white people/entities.

Jewish, not white. Jewish culture is distinct from generic white culture. You can get away with a lot with Jewish privilege, like Bill Maher's casual N-word use on television. A random white John Doe's career would have been done right there.

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