If the govt. was to force WhatsApp's hand, I'm sure we'd see democracy in action if they prevented everyone using the app for 24 hours, replacing the facility to message with a note telling users to contact their local MP (with clickable email / phone numbers - and maybe links to the ORG).
UK Home Secretary says encryption on messaging services is unacceptable
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Re: UK Home Secretary says encryption on messaging services is unacceptable
#242Earlier quoted context omitted.
No, because we also have the right to privacy.
I beg to differ. My (and everyone's else) right to have a copy of tcpdump doesn't violate you right to privacy.
Sure, but how do you feel about a person's right over their personal information being systematically collected by their government, several large corporate entities, and a dozen or so international spy agencies? What about when this information is used to economically bind them into submission?
Re: UK Home Secretary says encryption on messaging services is unacceptable
#243Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Of course, we need to make sure it is used for anti-terrorism only. See that's the problem everyone is talking about. The thing, is, turns out you can't. That's was the ENTIRE point of the Snowden revelations. No sane person is okay with terrorism, but at what point are you going to stop relinquishing your rights? First, texts with Whatsapp. Then your phone calls. Then your bags and notes when you go through airpor…
One solution in my mind is the source code of the monitoring software must be reviewed by independent and trusted software engineers/experts.
How do you ensure that what was the reviewed source is what is actually being used? Also, how do you encode in source code who is the correct target to use this against, for now and in the future?
Re: UK Home Secretary says encryption on messaging services is unacceptable
#244Earlier quoted context omitted.
At some point, some politician is going to have to man up and speak the truth. The public will have to either accept that the government can try and protect it from low probability events by invading every aspect of our lives or people will have to accept the idea that there is a sub 1% chance of being killed by a crazy person.
Corbyn has already spoken up: Labour leader Jeremy Corbyn said authorities already had "huge powers". There had to be a balance between the "right to know" and "the right to privacy", he said. [1] Unfortunately when it came to actually doing something he provided practically no opposition to the Investigatory Powers Act. [1] http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-39396578
I suspect that will prove to be Corbyn's "tuition fees" moment. If he's still there by the next general election, the Lib Dems will surely attack him for being all talk and no action.
Re: UK Home Secretary says encryption on messaging services is unacceptable
#245If the govt. was to force WhatsApp's hand, I'm sure we'd see democracy in action if they prevented everyone using the app for 24 hours, replacing the facility to message with a note telling users to contact their local MP (with clickable email / phone numbers - and maybe links to the ORG).
Or even just put a banner at the top of the app.
Re: UK Home Secretary says encryption on messaging services is unacceptable
#246Looking away from the fact that what they want isn't actually achievable, what does the UK risk by beginning to go down this road? What consequences could this potentially have for their domestic tech sector?
My intuition says that they stand to lose more than they could possibly gain, but I'm curious to hear a more knowledgeable perspective.
Re: UK Home Secretary says encryption on messaging services is unacceptable
#247Looking away from the fact that what they want isn't actually achievable, what does the UK risk by beginning to go down this road? What consequences could this potentially have for their domestic tech sector?
My intuition says that they stand to lose more than they could possibly gain, but I'm curious to hear a more knowledgeable perspective.
Re: UK Home Secretary says encryption on messaging services is unacceptable
#248So when they discover that he wrote and sent actual letters, will they then demand access to open our mail? Also: Will breaking encryption stop a man grabbing a knife and jumping into his car? No.
> So when they discover that he wrote and sent actual letters, will they then demand access to open our mail?
Except, like, with a warrant, they can already open our mail. That's a pre-existing power.
The difference is under the current legislation a warrant doesn't get them the ability to read WhatsApp conversations; that's the point of contention here, and the difference with the above is perceived to be the problem.
Re: UK Home Secretary says encryption on messaging services is unacceptable
#249I assume that the UK government has been doing these extremely pro-surveillance, anti-encryption, and anti-porn stances because they detect sufficient support from the UK population?
Re: UK Home Secretary says encryption on messaging services is unacceptable
#250How do they want to prevent someone from creating his own end-to-end encryption app? It may use other protocols to encode content (images, tweets, fb posts etc.). For me it seems to be more in a direction of so called "Big Brother" than real counter-terrorism.
The same way you prevent anything.. they make it illegal for people in the UK to make, or use, such products. Don't think we can "tech" our way out of this.
Tell that to the pirate bay.
Just because something is illegal doesn't mean it is enforceable.