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TTIP Leaks

ttip-leaks.org

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Re: TTIP Leaks

#241

Post by PavlovsCat »

ppod wrote: post #58
grecy wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This is a takeover attempt through the backdoor. In case it wasn't already immensely obvious, the third world war has been underway for some time. This one isn't a war fought with guns and bombs, it's a war fought with information, deals and economies. See China's massive economy and ownership of the US, the massive drop in oil price and what that's done to the world economy etc. The citizens of the world wouldn't…

>this is what we get when countries still want to dominate each other. The most peaceful, prosperous, and healthy period known in human history?

> > this is what we get when countries still want to dominate each other.

> The most peaceful, prosperous, and healthy period known in human history?

We don't have that because of war profiteers and other exploiters and murderers, but despite them. And there's no telling how much better it would be without all the ballast and poison.

Re: TTIP Leaks

#242

Post by tamana »

mvanvoorden wrote: post #72
ppod wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>this is what we get when countries still want to dominate each other. The most peaceful, prosperous, and healthy period known in human history?

You're repeating propaganda. May be there's less violence, but the amount of suffering has skyrocketed over the years. A more than significant amount of people are dependent on tranquilizers and anti-depressants to make their life bearable, because for them it has become mundane and meaningless without. Statistiscs may tell a story of less violence, and people getting older and having more material possessions, but t…

People weren't less depressed before Prozac, except if they were too busy starving or laboring.

Re: TTIP Leaks

#243

Post by jessaustin »

odonnellryan wrote: post #208
gumby wrote: post #202

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> larger population [...] probably isn't a great thing. Julian Simon would have strongly disagreed and he put his money where his mouth was in his famous bets with Erlich: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Julian_Simon

Yes, but he actually got lucky. Given the average of any 10-year period in the last 100 years I believe Simon would have been wrong.

It might not have been Simon's good luck, because Erlich's luck when it comes to prediction has been consistently bad.

Re: TTIP Leaks

#244

Post by tamana »

blue_dinner wrote: post #114
mvanvoorden wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're repeating propaganda. May be there's less violence, but the amount of suffering has skyrocketed over the years. A more than significant amount of people are dependent on tranquilizers and anti-depressants to make their life bearable, because for them it has become mundane and meaningless without. Statistiscs may tell a story of less violence, and people getting older and having more material possessions, but t…

"May be there's less violence, but the amount of suffering has skyrocketed over the years. A more than significant amount of people are dependent on tranquilizers and anti-depressants to make their life bearable, because for them it has become mundane and meaningless without." I don't think this is very accurate. People get hooked on painkillers usually because they had some sort of accident and need them for pain...…

Nice. "You can't blame us for buying things from people who use slave labor and slaughter their slaves by the millions if they don't cooperate."

Re: TTIP Leaks

#245

Post by tamana »

mikeyouse wrote: post #157
wmeredith wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cucked?

The alt-right / white nationalist movement has been using 'cucked' for a few years now as some sort of reflexive utterance for anything they don't like. Convenient shorthand to figure out which people can be safely ignored. https://www.splcenter.org/hatewatch/2015/08/07/getting-cucky...

Alt-right vs SPLC ranting is a debate that is not needed on HN.

Re: TTIP Leaks

#246

Post by tamana »

Bombthecat wrote: post #64
tdkl wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The corporations have hijacked the US government years ago it was always only the matter of time that they'll spread to EU. What saddens me more is that the cucked EU will let them, forgetting all the achievements this continent has to offer.

How else do you want to compete with Korea, China and Japan with there cheap workforce. There is no other than to dump down massively on social nets and wages.

Tarriffs, the way nations have peacefully defended their citizens for centuries.

Re: TTIP Leaks

#247

Post by tamana »

leaveyou wrote: post #12
tommyman wrote: post #9

So business groups and lobbyists for companies like IBM, Apple, Google et al. are deeply involved in the US side of negotiations (far more than any public interest groups). Then on the EU side, business groups and lobbyists for companies like IBM, Apple, Google et al. are deeply involved in negotiations to the detriment of all public groups. So this is really lots of big US companies negotiating with themselves on ho…

What you say seems quite plausible and I wonder if this scheme wasn't used before against EU interests. US has the ability to spy basically any person in EU. That has serious implications.

You mean like ECHELON?

Re: TTIP Leaks

#248

Post by gumby »

odonnellryan wrote: post #208
gumby wrote: post #202

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> larger population [...] probably isn't a great thing. Julian Simon would have strongly disagreed and he put his money where his mouth was in his famous bets with Erlich: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Julian_Simon

Yes, but he actually got lucky. Given the average of any 10-year period in the last 100 years I believe Simon would have been wrong.

Can you show some data online to back that up? I'm genuinely curious.

Re: TTIP Leaks

#249

Post by dragontamer »

PavlovsCat wrote: post #240
dragontamer wrote: post #231

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right. You just keep ignoring the good parts of history. You do realize that America opened up Concentration Camps inside of the Philippine-American War? Americans retaliated against the Philippinos by creating such lovely orders like "Kill everyone over the age of 10". https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jacob_H._Smith#Samar_campaign > "I want no prisoners. I wish you to kill and burn, the more you kill and burn the bette…

The baseline isn't even worse stuff, the baseline is decency.

I tend to be a bit more pragmatic.

The human race is composed of neither angels nor devils: but humans. Beings with flawed and incomplete morality. Its best if we judge ourselves by comparing against the actions of our fathers, otherwise we may lose ourselves in idealism.

The claim after all, is that the current time is the most prosperous and peaceful time of all of human existence. And as far as I can tell, actual history agrees with this fact.

Don't believe me? Go back to the root comment if you've forgotten the claim: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11610816

You may be worried about a few thousand innocent deaths here and there, but again, that number is much much MUCH much smaller than the historical norm. But in any case, your idealism is a good thing. It is only further proof that we as a race are beginning to forget the horrors of war, because peace has existed for so long.

(Of course, some humans still exist in war-torn areas. Syrian and Iraqi refugees. And I am peace-loving and idealistic enough that I believe we should open up our country to these people, despite the risks. )

Re: TTIP Leaks

#250

Post by nitrogen »

tacos wrote: post #206
soperj wrote: post #205

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You may have starved. Everyone else would have continued to rely on the steam tractors that were in use well into the 30s. I'm sure most aircraft carriers would be powered the same way nuclear subs are powered now.

Ah yes. Wake up a few extra hours before sunrise to load crisp, clean-burning coal into a furnace. Then fiddle with dials waiting for it to come up to pressure without exploding. Then drag a cast iron boiler and tons of water (!) on tiny wheels across muddy fields, generating 15 horsepower. Built to scale!

generating 15 horsepower

You don't need a lot of horsepower to replace a horse. Quite literally, one would be enough.

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