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Mouseless – keyboard-driven control of macOS/Linux/Windows

mouseless.click

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Re: Mouseless – keyboard-driven control of macOS/Linux/Windows

#231

Post by partyficial »

FabHK wrote: post #224
nusl wrote: post #223

Monthly subscriptions for software like this confuse me. The website also obscures that it's paid at all - the first option is "download for X", then the next option is a red button to "unlock". No pricing link/page, nothing. Aimed at getting you to download and use it, then fork up later. References mentioned all going on about productivity etc. Red flags all-round.

You click on the Unlock button, and it tells you pricing for monthly, annual, or lifetime. Not exactly rocket science.

- app named Mouseless

- need to CLICK on Unlock to show pricing

(just thought it was funny)

Re: Mouseless – keyboard-driven control of macOS/Linux/Windows

#233

Post by swiftcoder »

It is so weird to me, as someone who entered computing before mice were widespread, that we've just let all the interface designers remove keyboard support.

Even mouse-centric platforms like the Macintosh used to have fairly comprehensive keyboard navigation...

Re: Mouseless – keyboard-driven control of macOS/Linux/Windows

#234

Post by applfanboysbgon »

swiftcoder wrote: post #233

It is so weird to me, as someone who entered computing before mice were widespread, that we've just let all the interface designers remove keyboard support. Even mouse-centric platforms like the Macintosh used to have fairly comprehensive keyboard navigation...

It's not weird at all. Keyboards are an obvious power-user mechanic; you have to memorise how to navigate different programs differently, and really even just memorising one program is quite an ask. It is infinitely easier for the average user to work with between one and three input buttons and their eyes than it is to memorise 40 hotkeys + modifier key combinations + chords + modes, so it's simply common sense that as computers expanded from a niche serving 100k nerds into something serving billions of humans, interface design priorities would change. Nerds didn't have the ability to 'let' interface designers do anything; interface designers can just ignore nerds because normal people outnumber nerds by 10000:1.

Re: Mouseless – keyboard-driven control of macOS/Linux/Windows

#235

Post by swiftcoder »

xp84 wrote: post #217
stuart78 wrote: post #214

A while back I had to install a bluetooth mouse on a Mac mini with out existing mouse attached. It was a nightmare only reserved after lots of searching on my phone to enable the accessibility mode setting allowing arrow-based mouse movement. The System Settings app seemed so incredibly hostile to keyboard navigation. I was able to start it, but tab only moves you in and out of the search window. From there, you can…

Thing is, Apple has no standards for keyboard navigation of native UIs to bring back, except if you turn on the accessibility feature I think called “Full Keyboard Access” which is supposed to let you tab to any control instead of only text fields. The Mac once had zero ability to navigate a dialog without a mouse, other than Enter/Return to do the default button, and Cmd-period (later ESC once it appeared) for cance…

> Thing is, Apple has no standards for keyboard navigation of native UIs to bring back

Huh? All menus and dialogs on Mac are navigable by keyboard. I don't recall a time when they weren't.

Unfortunately none of the necessary keyboard shortcuts are actually called out in the UI (we long for the days of Keys! on OS9)

Re: Mouseless – keyboard-driven control of macOS/Linux/Windows

#236

Post by swiftcoder »

applfanboysbgon wrote: post #234
swiftcoder wrote: post #233

It is so weird to me, as someone who entered computing before mice were widespread, that we've just let all the interface designers remove keyboard support. Even mouse-centric platforms like the Macintosh used to have fairly comprehensive keyboard navigation...

It's not weird at all. Keyboards are an obvious power-user mechanic; you have to memorise how to navigate different programs differently, and really even just memorising one program is quite an ask. It is infinitely easier for the average user to work with between one and three input buttons and their eyes than it is to memorise 40 hotkeys + modifier key combinations + chords + modes, so it's simply common sense that…

[dead]

Re: Mouseless – keyboard-driven control of macOS/Linux/Windows

#237

Post by someguyiguess »

layer8 wrote: post #138
philistine wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I get that this might annoy you, but there is a direct trace all the way back to the original Mac in 1984 that required a mouse. As time went on and the two other OSes we still have gained mouse support (Windows, Linux) from their keyboard roots, they brought forward their ethos of keyboard navigation. Mac OS resolutely stayed attached to its mouse only roots.

It was a significant downside of MacOS from the beginning, and it still is.

That seems incredibly subjective. For people with carpal tunnel like myself, having to do everything on the keyboard can be very painful. The mouse alleviates that and gives visual feedback.
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