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The seed oil panic is hurting my cardiac patients

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Re: The seed oil panic is hurting my cardiac patients

#231

Post by lithocarpus »

eudamoniac wrote: post #227
lithocarpus wrote: post #154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are tons of possible symptoms because systemic inflammation including from dietary causes basically damages the entire body. But here's a list of some common symptoms from one source: persistent pain, chronic fatigue or insomnia, joint stiffness, skin problems, elevated blood markers (such as C-reactive protein), gastrointestinal issues (constipation, diarrhoea, acid reflux), depression, anxiety and mood disord…

So basically every possible psychosomatic and unverifiable symptom, plus a bunch that can have infinity different causes, and no clinical test for this "inflammation". Curious!

There are clinical tests for systemic inflammation. But there are also lots of potential causes of systemic inflammation, so testing for high inflammation consistently will tell you there's something wrong, but not what exactly is wrong or causing it.

Re: The seed oil panic is hurting my cardiac patients

#232

Post by aziaziazi »

nekzn wrote: post #57
onion2k wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is that even possible with the current food supply chain though?

Obviously. But you also need the time to cook and not to have the appetite of a 10 year old. The latter, from what I've observed, is quite common in grown adults.

What do you mean by "appetite of a 10yo” ? 10yo that are 75% vegan are not rare and the appetite comes with habits. Changing is far easier for a 10yo than a 75yo.

Why "cook”? In a hurry I grab a can of bean, a carrot, a branch of celery, some rye bred and a square of tofu. No prep or tooling except a spoon for the beans.

Something hot at the snack? Grab a veggie pad thaï, veggie pizza, veggie burger (with actual veggies), daal with veggies…

Re: The seed oil panic is hurting my cardiac patients

#233

Post by robertlagrant »

Analemma_ wrote: post #123
bob1029 wrote: post #71

Seed oils probably aren't ideal, but I also worry how much this narrative is distracting from the bigger problem of sugar consumption. Humans only have so much attention and discipline. It would be a shame to focus all that energy on a "no seed oil" diet only to wind up even more unhealthy. How many products with seed oil also contain some form of added sugar? I don't seem to have much issue with moderating the occas…

My half-believed conspiracy theory is that "seed oils bad" is a psy-op from the corn/HFCS industries. I don't have hard data here, but it seemed like in the late 2010s people were converging on added sugar and especially HFCS as the thing which is truly messing up health. I can't help but wonder if the corn industry saw this, panicked, and began seeding (no pun intended) the seed oil meme among influencers. I don't h…

I was reading things[0] about sugar a lot earlier than that - maybe 2007? And it made a lot of sense back then.

[0] https://nosdiet.com

Re: The seed oil panic is hurting my cardiac patients

#234

Post by WickyNilliams »

InMice wrote: post #19

I try to take the middle road: Making 50-75%+ of my calories come from refined, powderized carbs and sugar (original food pyramid) - Bad Eating whole foods, lightly cooked. Whole food starch sources, often retrograde starch. avoid high heat fried foods, eat mostly leaner meats - Good Declaring plants and seed oils evil, nothing but lard, tallow and red meat and a dozen eggs a day - Bad Two meals day with no snacking…

Curious why you categorize lightly cooked as good but high heat as bad? Do you mean deep fried specifically? Or any high heat?

Re: The seed oil panic is hurting my cardiac patients

#235

Post by orwin »

ikidd wrote: post #230
newdee wrote: post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The sugar you get from fruit is also accompanied by fiber, water and other nutrients. Also harder to overeat and generally gets released into the bloodstream more slowly. I think the argument here is to eat less (highly) processed food in favour of whole foods.

I've known people that think switching to fruit juice from sugar sodas was going to fix them; very much not. Doesn't matter where you get the sugar, sugar is sugar and is not good for you or your arteries or weight loss.

Fruit juice you didn't press yourself have no fibers.

Honestly, the 'avoir sugar' crowd is wrong in its messaging, the correct message should be 'increase your fiber intake'.

Also an effect of fiber is that it increases your transit speed and quality a lot (a lot). I don't know if that also have an effect on how much sugar and fat is absorbed in the small intestine, but I recently managed to loose weight I had a lot of trouble eliminating without changing my calorie intake. Basically I went from 115 kg to 95 with reducing my calorie intake without much trouble (stopped sugar and alcohol basically) in 2-3 years, and didn't manage to go much lower in the last 6 year (I was around 90-88 by starting physical activity, but those 5kg took 4 years to loose and I stabilized again). But I recently had transit issues, and started eating more fiber like 3 months ago. I lost 1 kg over the timeframe, while having a way better time on the toilets, and it was even easier than stopping sugar (just eat more greens, beans and oats), as I didn't change my meal size.

Re: The seed oil panic is hurting my cardiac patients

#236

Post by ndsipa_pomu »

port11 wrote: post #186

> My real worry about seed oil theory is that it’s a distraction. If you want to be healthier, we know ways you can change your diet that will help: Increase your overall diet “quality”. Eat lots of fruits and vegetables. Avoid processed food. Especially avoid processed meats. Eat food with low caloric density. Avoid added sugar. Avoid alcohol. Avoid processed food. > I know this is hard. You could even argue it’s un…

> we need to stop thinking of ‘magic bullets’ that’ll get us out of eating better

I daresay that dietary fibre is likely the only 'magic bullet' that would improve people's diets and health. Or at least, non-processed fibre as some "food products" have cellulose/sawdust added to bump up the fibre figure.

Re: The seed oil panic is hurting my cardiac patients

#237

Post by HappMacDonald »

orwin wrote: post #235
ikidd wrote: post #230

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've known people that think switching to fruit juice from sugar sodas was going to fix them; very much not. Doesn't matter where you get the sugar, sugar is sugar and is not good for you or your arteries or weight loss.

Fruit juice you didn't press yourself have no fibers. Honestly, the 'avoir sugar' crowd is wrong in its messaging, the correct message should be 'increase your fiber intake'. Also an effect of fiber is that it increases your transit speed and quality a lot (a lot). I don't know if that also have an effect on how much sugar and fat is absorbed in the small intestine, but I recently managed to loose weight I had a lot…

Your thoughts on "Cracklin' oat bran"?

My thoughts are that it's too sweet, though I don't know what quality its fiber has: like is it decent dietary fiber or a nutrition label dodge of some sort.

Re: The seed oil panic is hurting my cardiac patients

#238

Post by tpm »

ikidd wrote: post #230
newdee wrote: post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The sugar you get from fruit is also accompanied by fiber, water and other nutrients. Also harder to overeat and generally gets released into the bloodstream more slowly. I think the argument here is to eat less (highly) processed food in favour of whole foods.

I've known people that think switching to fruit juice from sugar sodas was going to fix them; very much not. Doesn't matter where you get the sugar, sugar is sugar and is not good for you or your arteries or weight loss.

Yesterday I ate lots of sugar in the form of sweets. It happened during a 100km bike ride (against a strong headwind even) and I would otherwise bonk [0], so I'm pretty sure it was good for me, my arteries and my weight loss. And that's the issue with simple messaging like 'sugar bad'.

0. https://www.ride25.com/cycling-blog/bonking-birds-bees/

Re: The seed oil panic is hurting my cardiac patients

#239

Post by ndsipa_pomu »

WarmWash wrote: post #213
gruez wrote: post #190

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>These random bloggers/influencers speaking from self-proclaimed high ground is in large part how we got in this mess. There are a gazillion people out there who know how to say the right things, to get the right minds, the click the right "follow" buttons, none of which has any bearing on truth, honesty, or accuracy. Did you get to the end? He addresses that. >I’ll just be honest. I think this view is completely ind…

Why would I spend my time reading a random blog? The author makes no effort anywhere on the site to give themselves any credibility. They don't even give their name or occupation. A google search lends no more real information either. From my POV it might as well be a youtube comment that is 8 pages long.

> Why would I spend my time reading a random blog?

Because other HackerNews readers have determined that it's interesting.

Ideally, you should let the quality of the writing be more important to you than who wrote it. However, I've read enough previous blog posts from there that I recognise the "dynomight" name as being worth a click and a read.

Re: The seed oil panic is hurting my cardiac patients

#240

Post by ndsipa_pomu »

muttonette wrote: post #210
perrygeo wrote: post #181

Earlier quoted context omitted.

yes, sorry its an important distinction. Especially raw whole fruits since they are packed with fiber and nutrients and hard to overeat.

you can overeat fruit and vegetables and not all fruit is the same. Bananas vs kale is a good example. You should eat more kale, but you should avoid bananas unless they’re green (lots of resistant starch)

I suspect that the vast majority of the population is not overeating fruit and vegetables. Even if someone is eating ripe bananas, that's likely to be much better for them than eating another portion of fries/chips etc.
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