Earlier quoted context omitted.
The preponderance of evidence to date would point to systems engineered by meatbags are of a significantly higher quality than vibe coded ones. My use of the word “system” is very intentional vs. something less qualifying like “program”. Edit to add: my take is proper system engineering and design basically requires general intelligence, so the bar for LLMs to reliably produce high quality systems is AGI.
It's no longer a choice. The AI is already causing changes in how competition, investors and users behave.
Where Are the Vibecoded Photoshops?
231–240 of 410 posts
Re: Where Are the Vibecoded Photoshops?
#232(The domain, FWIW, is a geospatial transport-planning tool, including a completely custom microsimulation engine, with loads of options for visualization, analytics, etc.)
At the start of this development process, LLMs were capable of assisting with little more than the framework boilerplate stuff. That was very useful, but was well under 50% of the LOC. They were particularly bad at understanding the microsimulator, where they would routinely forget which end of a FIFO queue was the front. LLMs are routinely and correctly criticized for their lack of a true world model, and when it came to modelling real-world physical/spatial/geographic systems, the fact that they see the world as nothing but text was a huge limitation. Not just in terms of having a pretty hazy grasp on concepts like "spatial direction", but even more critically, being unable to rationalize about the "world-within-a-world" which the simulator is attempting to model. They were fully unable to do that.
That was 18 months ago. Now, Claude writes > 99% of my code. It demonstrates a far better grasp of first-order world-model phenomena (like "spatial orientation"), and a decent (but not fantastic) ability to reason about the second-order "world-within-a-world" that the simulator is creating. It's a huge improvement. For some areas of the code, I still need to spell things out very explicitly, giving precise instructions for how a method will work. That's definitely not vibe-coding. But for other areas of the code, I can just say "add this analysis or visualization feature", without specifying how, and Claude will one-shot a result that's somewhere between good and great.
So where we're at now is that Claude often needs hand-holding for some of the most complex areas of the code, and it definitely doesn't understand how the whole application hangs together -- I have to keep reminding it of that, and am constantly taking steps to ensure that it remains well-architected doesn't devolve into a collection of warring patches.
And yet -- in the past 18 months, the boundary between what the LLM is capable of and what I need to exercise control over has shifted MASSIVELY, and it has shifted in the direction of LLMs being more able to rationalize about meta-models and higher-order architectures.
I've got two small children. When they say they can't do something, I always remind them that they can't do that thing -- YET. What they can do today is very far from the ultimate limits of their capabilities. I feel similarly about the capabilities of LLMs. No, they definitely can't vibecode a Photoshop-class application. YET.
Re: Where Are the Vibecoded Photoshops?
#233Earlier quoted context omitted.
Exactly this. Anti-AI Devs/Techies have their heads in the sand or/and resorting to binary thinking when it comes to AI. No one is going to vibe code a Photoshop replacement just like no average smartphone user is going to take prize winning photographs with their phone or directly compete with professional photographs. What is going to happen is what happened to videographers and photographers and what is happening…
> neither will the one off random app that only your household uses This reminds me a bit of the 2010s idea that every house would have a 3D printer to make one off repairs. Years later, this still seems far out of reach. If anything, it seems to have been settled that most non-technicals don't want a 3D printer. Vibe coded apps are great, but unless they're hitting an already open API, they're effectively hermetic.…
The problem with that is, like many people found out the hard way, that printing is the easy part and 3D CAD design is much harder.
Many people now have 3D printers to print all kinds of useful tools, though, and there are businesses dedicated to one-off prints for the very occasional repair.
Re: Where Are the Vibecoded Photoshops?
#234I don't think that's the direction this is going to take. Replacing a mature app with an incredibly wide audience and a million use cases may or may not be possible, but what's actually happening is that people are making an app that does exactly what they want, and using it to solve their own needs. Previously you might use Excel to take raw data from various places and analyze it, create charts, reports, extract fi…
Re: Where Are the Vibecoded Photoshops?
#235Earlier quoted context omitted.
Exactly this. I have an acquaintence who is a wine connoisseur and collector. He has done technical project management, but does not program himself. Over the course of several months, he has produced an app that manages a database of the wines he has. It's a lot more that just a CRUD-app. In addition to maintaining the obvious data (name, year, winery, notes, etc.), it can take a photo of the label, parse it, and fi…
what about the data? is it locally hosted? if he drops his phone everything will be lost? or are servers and databases involved? if so, where are they being hosted? how did he manage those? even these sorts of stories are incredibly shallow and hard to believe for me personally.
Re: Where Are the Vibecoded Photoshops?
#236Earlier quoted context omitted.
Sure, let’s see. So far there is nothing to justify the hype, and there is a lot of money and hype around this, and a lot of fervent true believers.
I am working like 20 hours a week on my new iOS app with Codex. People on here talk like it was some belief or suggest I am somehow profiting from "hyping" AI. Is it so hard to believe that agentic coding now works? Engineers are taking it up left and right. Edit with reply: I can't, because the app is still in the works. Also my HN account is again rate limited and I won't be able to post more comments. Edit number…
My gut reaction looking over your account is that you mean well but get a little heated. For example https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=48147587 responds to no one in particular and calls HN drivel. Don’t do that. Thoughts like that are normal, but expressing them is difficult to do in a substantive way. It’s often better to not say anything if you feel yourself getting upset. (There are plenty of exceptions to this, but you have to do it in a way where you’re writing for the audience here, not for yourself.)
I think if you really put your mind to it, you can write substantively and stay off the rate limit list. Good luck.
Re: Where Are the Vibecoded Photoshops?
#237I don't think that's the direction this is going to take. Replacing a mature app with an incredibly wide audience and a million use cases may or may not be possible, but what's actually happening is that people are making an app that does exactly what they want, and using it to solve their own needs. Previously you might use Excel to take raw data from various places and analyze it, create charts, reports, extract fi…
Re: Where Are the Vibecoded Photoshops?
#238I don't think that's the direction this is going to take. Replacing a mature app with an incredibly wide audience and a million use cases may or may not be possible, but what's actually happening is that people are making an app that does exactly what they want, and using it to solve their own needs. Previously you might use Excel to take raw data from various places and analyze it, create charts, reports, extract fi…
> How many people are just using ChatGPT or Gemini to get the image edits they want instead of reaching for Photoshop? Lately ChatGPT can generate complex diagrams with lots of text so I used them to make slides.
Re: Where Are the Vibecoded Photoshops?
#239Earlier quoted context omitted.
The recent ChatGPT Images 2.0 has awe-inspiring image editing and composition capabilities. I can totally see what people mean when they say "Photoshop killer".
Same experience on my end. It's crazy what the latest version can pull off, with reference images, text, etc.
Re: Where Are the Vibecoded Photoshops?
#240Not quite the direction I expected that to take, but I do agree with the broad strokes. LLMs lowering the cost of code isn't exactly solving software development, and is definitely not solving product development.