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Smoking ban for people born after 2008 in the UK agreed

bbc.co.uk

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Re: Smoking ban for people born after 2008 in the UK agreed

#231

Post by dml2135 »

olalonde wrote: post #81
bcjdjsndon wrote: post #3

Alcohol costs the UK 4-5x more than smoking. Coincidentally, it's the upper classes drug of choice. Must be a coincidence though

At least alcohol produces side effects that people enjoy. Smoking pretty much only has negative side effects once you get hooked.

Have you ever smoked? I feel like I only hear this sentiment from people that have never tried nicotine.

Nicotine absolutely produces effects that people enjoy. Smokers don't just do it because they want to smell bad and look cool.

Re: Smoking ban for people born after 2008 in the UK agreed

#232

Post by lokar »

cucumber3732842 wrote: post #227
lokar wrote: post #212

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That seems appropriate. A small fraction of people cause most of the losses, they should pay more.

>That seems appropriate. A small fraction of people cause most of the losses, they should pay more. Surely that was a satirical comment and was meant to be an illustrative example of exactly the sort of mindset that runs political cover for a system as it pivots from providing enough value to become entrenched to using that entrenched position to behave in an extractive manner. In my state if grandma gets pulled over…

I’ve never seen having an expired tag be a points violation, that seems very wrong. IME it’s only ever moving violations that impact safety. For that, higher rates are absolutely appropriate.

Re: Smoking ban for people born after 2008 in the UK agreed

#233

Post by nutjob2 »

slibhb wrote: post #153
FL33TW00D wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In a country with a national health system, why should you be able to internalize the benefit of smoking whilst externalizing the cost?

You could use this logic to ban unhealthy foods, or restrict people from eating too much.

This is just whataboutism, but the UK also regulates sugar in fairly draconian ways too, for example.

There are good reasons to target smoking given how addictive and deadly it is. Nicotine is fairly unique in this regard.

Re: Smoking ban for people born after 2008 in the UK agreed

#234

Post by BenjiWiebe »

dml2135 wrote: post #231
olalonde wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At least alcohol produces side effects that people enjoy. Smoking pretty much only has negative side effects once you get hooked.

Have you ever smoked? I feel like I only hear this sentiment from people that have never tried nicotine. Nicotine absolutely produces effects that people enjoy. Smokers don't just do it because they want to smell bad and look cool.

Is there proof that the positive effects are still there after you're hooked? Or are the "positive effects" at that point just a cessation of the negative effects of withdrawal?

Re: Smoking ban for people born after 2008 in the UK agreed

#235

Post by MiiMe19 »

projektfu wrote: post #186
alsetmusic wrote: post #33

As a former smoker (who quit for seven years and regrets taking it up again), and as a present-day vape user, wtf. This is a clear restriction on liberty. It may be stupid that I do it. Just like many stupid decisions (junk food included), it ought to be my right to decide how to live. Cut off production so cigarettes are no longer made or imported. Don't block me from them while letting others have them. (Not in UK)…

It's a restriction on liberty but not an unjustified one. I agree that it gives cigarettes a "mystique" that they do not deserve to have one generation able to smoke if they like while another generation has to go outside the law to do so. When I was a smoker, I used to decry places that were less liberal about where I was allowed to smoke, and places with high taxes. As a former smoker, I know that the high taxes ha…

If I want to smoke in my own home I should be able to. Next up the government will ban reading hacker news for people born after 2012 because it incentivizes you sitting in your chair too much.

Re: Smoking ban for people born after 2008 in the UK agreed

#236

Post by scoofy »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #217
alsetmusic wrote: post #33

As a former smoker (who quit for seven years and regrets taking it up again), and as a present-day vape user, wtf. This is a clear restriction on liberty. It may be stupid that I do it. Just like many stupid decisions (junk food included), it ought to be my right to decide how to live. Cut off production so cigarettes are no longer made or imported. Don't block me from them while letting others have them. (Not in UK)…

> wtf. This is a clear restriction on liberty The title is hyperbolic. It isn't a ban on smoking. It's a "ban on buying cigarettes." Commerce is being restricted, not consumption. If, presumably, you bring your own in from France, or someone bums one to you, it would appear you're free to smoke it. That broadly seems to strike a fair balance. Banning purchases and sales, not possession or consumption.

A lifetime ban on purchase is a ban. Don't be ridiculous.

Re: Smoking ban for people born after 2008 in the UK agreed

#237

Post by nutjob2 »

TheCoelacanth wrote: post #165
voidUpdate wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> "it ought to be my right to decide how to live" "Why is the government stopping me from murdering people and stealing from them? it's my right to decide how I live!"

I think that a government should be able to ban murdering people but that it would very sketchy for them to ban it for some people and not others. One of the most important foundations of democracy is that the law applies to everyone equally. If smoking is banned, it should be banned for everyone, not banned for some people and allowed for a privileged class who got here first.

This is nonsense. There is a logic to the law, it's not arbitrary.

I could argue (unsuccessfully) that it's discriminatory and unfair that I have to wait an extra 3 years to claim my pension compared to older people.

Re: Smoking ban for people born after 2008 in the UK agreed

#238

Post by MiiMe19 »

tgv wrote: post #30
comrade1234 wrote: post #19

Are they going to continue selling cigarettes and vapes for people born before that date. I've always found the career as a prohibition smuggler a somewhat romantic notion so at some point I may be able to take it up.

Ah yes, smuggling lung cancer. How romantic.

> Stop doing things that hurt you !! You need to live your life like a min-max optimization for max lifespan. !! You haven't done your government mandated hour of exercise today, enjoy 30 days in prison !!

Re: Smoking ban for people born after 2008 in the UK agreed

#240

Post by techteach00 »

bill_joy_fanboy wrote: post #97
techteach00 wrote: post #92

Hopefully vaping will still be legal? They do distinguish the difference between inhaling burnt matter vs inhaling a heated aerosol, yes? Of course not. The only thing government and private enterprise seems good at these days is taking things away from people. Logic be damned.

UK has public/socialized healthcare. If you are a smoker, you are much more likely to be a burden on this system. Makes sense to ban these types of activities if the costs of them are socialized rather than individualized.

You're making my point by making sweeping deeply personal policy for people without first citing how much less dangerous vaping nicotine is vs using tobacco.

My question is why aren't you or the people making these policies interested? It's consequential stuff done ignorantly and recklessly.

Determine scientifically how dangerous vaping nicotine or THC is before banning it. That's call rational. Not reckless

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