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Peptides: where to begin?

science.org

231–240 of 431 posts

Re: Peptides: where to begin?

#231
post #229

[flagged]

Is there any evidence supporting the claim there is a significant overlap between the group of people who "refuse injections the government recommends" and the group of people who take "peptides"? The article is carefully crafted to evoke this impression without clearly stating it, listing only anecdotal evidence.

RFK Jr using the blue dye stuff for one thing

Re: Peptides: where to begin?

#232
post #182

I'm here for two probably contradictory comments. The first is collagen: I'd love to see Lowe's take on recent peer review which says boosting oral collagen does appear to show signs of improved joint pain and skin resilience. Obviously modulated through how protein deprived you are, but for older people, eating enough protein can be an issue: it's not rapidly absorbed so you need 3 squares a day to get to the higher…

I want to point out your own contradictory comments about absorption and specifically mentioning a typically highly processed food (orange juice), one which has been stripped of its natural fibers and flavors.

That age group (and all others) should be eating real/whole fruit or having the juice fresh (I.e. just juiced). They would be better served getting this advice than creating more anxiety about protein intake.

Re: Peptides: where to begin?

#233

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It has a certain logic to it, and I think US tipping culture basically follows the same rules. Even if you almost always end up paying the bill + 20% tip, Americans like the idea that they could not pay the tip if the service was bad. The appearance of free action is appealing and preferable to being forced to pay the extra amount, even if you almost always pay the amount willingly anyway.

In my experience, everyone who defends tipping culture is defending not paying the tip. I don't buy this idea that someone likes tipping culture and still pays it. After all, you're free to tip anyone you want regardless of culture.

The problem is it is so ingrained in US culture that switching to tip-free has generally failed where tried, even in pro-labor lefty hoods in blue cities.

Numerous restaurants in NYC tried and flipped back over the last 10 years. Restauranteurs reported illogical / innumerate behavior where sales went down when they switched to untipped higher prices.

https://www.eater.com/21398973/restaurant-no-tipping-movemen...

The only restaurants that it stuck were Japanese restaurants that cater primarily to Japanese ex-pats, because culturally its familiar to them.

Re: Peptides: where to begin?

#234
post #229

[flagged]

Is there any evidence supporting the claim there is a significant overlap between the group of people who "refuse injections the government recommends" and the group of people who take "peptides"? The article is carefully crafted to evoke this impression without clearly stating it, listing only anecdotal evidence.

I imagine the entire Joe Rogan sphere with being anti vax (or vax skeptical)... While promoting a billion supplements.

Re: Peptides: where to begin?

#235
post #227
post #192

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There is a tension between empiricism and fundamentalism with much of medical science focusing on fundamentalism. This is a deeply unfair statement, and also a false dichotomy. Medical science is of course empiric. What you call "fundamentalism" is that compounds need to undergo a rigorous regiment of empiric testing before they are given to potentially millions of people. And no, it's not just because of Thalidomi…

I think the grandparent meant "fundamentalism" as "mechanistic", and lots of things we can know (as you say using the scientific method) to be useful long before we have a good mechanistic explanation of how they work. Some examples: aspirin (willow bark used for thousands of years, drug synthesized in 1897 and mechanism explained almost 100y later), or general anesthesia used again since mid 1800s and the mechanism…

But it is usually not necessary for approval of a compound to be able to describe how it works on a molecular or cellular level. What you need to show are three things: efficacy, safety and quality, so basically: the compound has the intended clinical benefit, has an acceptable safety profile and can be produced with a consistent manufacturing quality. Most compounds fail because of lack of efficacy (roughly half), and roughly a third because of lack of acceptable safety.

Re: Peptides: where to begin?

#236
post #228

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Was cost the reason you went for it over tirzepitide? I feel like retatrutide is still way too early to mess with, it's giving me real "vioxx" vibes of messing with too much at once.

No, I had access to free tirzepatide. I chose retatrutide because early results seemed promising and safe and since I was going to run a short-term self-trial I wanted the most effective peptide.

Hey, fair enough! To each their own.

Re: Peptides: where to begin?

#237

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I assume they're referring to the brief bit in the post that indicates that oral ingestion leads to a breakdown that makes oral supplements of amino acids pointless. They say it very briefly and they don't really outright assert it, it's just a sort of implied aside.

Sweeping statements in biochemistry must be made with caution. It is well known that there are some small peptides that are absorbed following oral administration. ...BPC-157 itself is said to be among this class. As are certain milk tripeptides: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lactotripeptides Interestingly enough, those two, as well as Gly-Pro-Hyp, are proline/hydroxyproline-rich, which might suggest that proline-ric…

I'm in agreement. It's the article that made the sweeping statement.

Re: Peptides: where to begin?

#238
I think we are sort of in the worst of both worlds right now re: medicines/supplements/gray market.

FDA approval is expensive slow process. Doctors train for a long time and then work 40+ years entire careers, some without a ton of continuing education.

But then we have an entire gray market because enough legal and practical loopholes to drive a freight train through, such that people are self medicating with dubious substances of dubious origin of dubious purity sourced via dubious means.

Even if peptides work, you have no idea what side effects they have, or if the ones you are taking are even real, not contaminated/tainted in some manner, etc. Given a lot of the hype comes from social media for otherwise healthy people to take them for lifestyle / augmentation reasons.. to me the risks still outweigh the rewards.

Real solutions like regulatory reforms to find ways to bring down testing costs seem more important than reforms to make it easier to slap anything on the shelf at GNC as a completely untested “supplement”.

Re: Peptides: where to begin?

#239
post #229

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is there any evidence supporting the claim there is a significant overlap between the group of people who "refuse injections the government recommends" and the group of people who take "peptides"? The article is carefully crafted to evoke this impression without clearly stating it, listing only anecdotal evidence.

RFK Jr using the blue dye stuff for one thing

How?

Re: Peptides: where to begin?

#240
post #229

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is there any evidence supporting the claim there is a significant overlap between the group of people who "refuse injections the government recommends" and the group of people who take "peptides"? The article is carefully crafted to evoke this impression without clearly stating it, listing only anecdotal evidence.

I imagine the entire Joe Rogan sphere with being anti vax (or vax skeptical)... While promoting a billion supplements.

*anti untested vaccines - people should be skeptical of untested vaccines, just like peptides.
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