Live data from Hacker News

Prediction markets are ushering in a world in which news becomes about gambling

theatlantic.com

231–240 of 517 posts

Re: Prediction markets are ushering in a world in which news becomes about gambling

#231

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It gives people in power, wether it be the government or even an NBA ref, a vehicle to profit off of conflicts of interest / fixing games / etc... Ive seen people point out White House press conferences do weird shit, like cut the conference 10 seconds before some polymarket prop bet of "how long will this press conference be". Much more heinously, a few months ago right before one of Trumps asinine tariff announceme…

There's a "cloudflare outage" market. If I worked at CF I'd absolutely bet to win 5mn and then cause an outage and retire.

[deleted]

Re: Prediction markets are ushering in a world in which news becomes about gambling

#232
post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If the prediction market is for a non-trivial amount, it's likely someone is going to kill you in exchange for the money the prediction market offered them . The prediction market isn't acting as a prophet here, it's acting as a plausibly deniable murder for hire service and you are its victim. The people "betting against" you dying just paid to have you killed.

Exactly, these markets exist in the real world, so as their size and use increases, the more likely the odds will influence real world events. Look at sports betting for a much smaller example. Match fixing is known. Electricity markets are gamed for individual profits at the detriment to everyone and the stability of the system, even with regulators trying to keep things stable. Enough "Market for all the things" al…

> Enough "Market for all the things" already..

See, there are two major flavours of pro-market attitudes. The first one is "if we allow many independent individuals to try their own approaches to a problem and let the people with "better" approach to personally profit from it handsomely and make them compete against each other in an environment with objective-ish judgement of "what is better" instead of "impress the (inevitably corruptible) officials to be judged victorious and awarded the fortunes", and also manually guard and regulate against several universally known ways to sabotage such competition, then we'll be able to channel human ingenuity into solving difficult to solve technical problems while also rewarding those who are able to come up with (and implement) such solutions with low overseeing overhead". Of course, such an attitude isn't strictly speaking "pro-market", it's been around since ancient times; hell, the USSR of all places had this attitude in spades until about the 70s or so.

The second one is "Nah, we don't have to try and think about anything ourselves, just let people fend for themselves, they'll figure it out, and it won't have any unforeseen bad side effects, why would it; markets are magical like that!" Yeah, about that...

Re: Prediction markets are ushering in a world in which news becomes about gambling

#233
post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't really think so. You just swapped the term king to Oligarchs. In fact the Oligarchs are even worse because people think that they have freedom when they might not in fact have such freedom in the first place.

I swapped “kings” plural for “oligarchs” plural

I am laughing if its a joke lmaooo, just now realized it all of a sudden lol

pardon me I wrote king instead of kings and what you wrote in this comment felt like questionable to me first but now comical LMAO.

But my point still stands and aside from this mistake, I am curious in knowing the real answer to my question even now!

Re: Prediction markets are ushering in a world in which news becomes about gambling

#234
Is insider betting illegal? I know it's illegal in the sports context, but not necessarily in other areas.

Even for insider trading, it's illegal not because it's unfair, but because the insider is considered to be stealing information from shareholders. For example, it's not illegal for a company to buy back stocks while holding insider information.

Not legal advice of course.

Re: Prediction markets are ushering in a world in which news becomes about gambling

#235
post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They're also heavily, heavily fixed of course. There's nothing stopping anonymous folks from betting on things they control/influence.

That's the point. To surface non-public information as a price signal.

Disagree here. That's the stated goal and the point for some folks, but the subset I explained above also exists and their point is to benefit from a false sense of security.

Re: Prediction markets are ushering in a world in which news becomes about gambling

#236
post #127

> The irony of prediction markets is that they are supposed to be a more trustworthy way of gleaning the future than internet clickbait and half-baked punditry, but they risk shredding whatever shared trust we still have left. The suspiciously well-timed bets that one Polymarket user placed right before the capture of Nicolás Maduro may have been just a stroke of phenomenal luck that netted a roughly $400,000 payout.…

> I'm trying to understand what the criticism is here

You're correct in your understanding of prediction markets with respect to traders using insider information. There are a couple things going on here. One is the subtext from most news media now that Technology Bad. New technologies are treated as guilty until proven innocent, because that is a more engaging narrative for readers. So in this case, those covering this stuff immediately latch onto the rich get richer, insider trading viewpoint, and that gets reported without any analysis of why that might actually be desirable.

Second, prediction markets, in trying to become broadly accessible to "normal" people and desiring liquidity, need a marketing strategy that is understandable. They can't put out a Robin Hanson article as marketing material. So they market by appealing to something people do already understand, which is gambling. The public has this idea now of prediction markets as a way to make money, not as a tool for learning information. So the default perspective on insider trading is now one of unfairness: somebody used their privileged position to make money. The correct perspective is, in fact, that prediction markets are providing users with value by eliciting information from those insiders, information that the public would not otherwise have. The latter perspective is mostly foreign to degenerate gamblers, and the marketing campaigns of Kalshi and Polymarket aren't helping.

Re: Prediction markets are ushering in a world in which news becomes about gambling

#237
post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Insider trading is not about fairness, it is about theft" is a uniquely American approach that is not shared by other jurisdictions.

Where the hell did you read that

Probably Matt Levine.

Re: Prediction markets are ushering in a world in which news becomes about gambling

#238
post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I swapped “kings” plural for “oligarchs” plural

I am laughing if its a joke lmaooo, just now realized it all of a sudden lol pardon me I wrote king instead of kings and what you wrote in this comment felt like questionable to me first but now comical LMAO. But my point still stands and aside from this mistake, I am curious in knowing the real answer to my question even now!

I don’t have an opinion on if it’s worse or not because some people mistakenly think they are free.

I meant that from the perspective of how market forces play out, hyper concentration of wealth into a few actors looks the same whether the title of the those actors is “king” or “oligarch”.

You start losing the wisdom of the crowds effect the market gives if you have a handful of people making the decisions for the entire market

Re: Prediction markets are ushering in a world in which news becomes about gambling

#239

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It doesn't really work, up until a few weeks before the NYC mayoral election. Polymarket had Andrew Cuomo winning by double digits. It's a trash platform.

There are much better ways to tell if a prediction market is well calibrated than a single anecdote. And if it works so poorly, there's a lot of easy money to be made.

But this isn't a prediction market... those are highly regulated. This is just making money off of insider info. So yeah, not only does it work poorly it's entire reason for existing is to help people get richer while fucking over others.

Re: Prediction markets are ushering in a world in which news becomes about gambling

#240
post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's okay, when the next administration enforces the laws we'll see all the VC ghouls attack and decry the government for having the audacity to protect citizens from abuse.

Polymarket has been around for a while. I thought the agreement happened under the Biden admin, but I could be wrong.

Prediction markets are highly regulated, it's just not being enforced... This is just a way to launder money to those with insider info to profit from. Also who the fuck cares if it happened under Biden? Is that some sort of gotcha you conjured up? Democratic members hate the democratic party more than Trump, no one cares about Biden or what he did but they sure do care what he failed to do.
Post reply on HN