Social Cooling (2017) • Hacker News Board

Re: Social Cooling (2017)

#231

Post by DirkH » Mon, Oct 06, 2025, 4:20 AM UTC

softwaredoug wrote: post #133

This site makes the wrong conclusion. People game their social scores by being provocative edgelords. There’s almost no incentive on social media to conform. And every incentive to stand out. Just look around at our political situation, you see far less conformity, and extremes in political expression. We even elected President Edgelord.

Bimodal distribution. Edgelords are amplified as is conformity. People are being pushed more and more to the opposite ends.

Both conclusions can be right at the same time.

Re: Social Cooling (2017)

#232

Post by DirkH » Mon, Oct 06, 2025, 4:32 AM UTC

FirmwareBurner wrote: post #138

nathan_compton wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People say this but is it true? Young people, for instance, increasingly say that political violence may be justified. That doesn't sound like a safe opinion.

>Young people, for instance, increasingly say that political violence may be justified This is gonna get downvoted for sure because HNs bias, but based on current events, it's only the left that does that. Right-wingers may say hurtful words but don't seem too keen on murdering opponents for political reasons or disagreements. At least not yet.

The left is statistically more likely to publicly endorse political violence looking at data over the past few years. The right is more likely to actually commit political violence though looking over all data over decades and that still holds today.

Far-left versus Far-right Fatal Violence: An Empirical Assessment of the Prevalence of Ideologically Motivated Homicides in the United States

One side is all shout and no bite. The other is no shout and then eat your fucking face.

I'll take the idiots shouting but not actually killing if I had to pick. But I won't lie the choice still makes me feel dirty.

Re: Social Cooling (2017)

#233

Post by A4ET8a8uTh0_v2 » Mon, Oct 06, 2025, 5:13 AM UTC

wat10000 wrote: post #199

A4ET8a8uTh0_v2 wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Um. There is a notable difference between state sanctioned violence, for which, state does claim monopoly and semi-random vigilantes. I am concerned that I even have to point this out ( edit ) that the two are not quite the same.

Yeah. State-sanctioned violence is a fuckton scarier. Do you think state-sanctioned violence can't be described as "political violence" or that it can't be used to murder political opponents? If so, may I introduce you to most of history?

I think, and I would like to think it was covered in civics, that state sanctioned violence is one of the few types that society allows for practical reasons. What I personally think the problem in this conversation is oddly simple: severe conflation of various related issues.

You may be well-intentioned, but you are not exactly convincing me to 'your side'.

Re: Social Cooling (2017)

#234

Post by worik » Mon, Oct 06, 2025, 5:15 AM UTC

A4ET8a8uTh0_v2 wrote: post #191

worik wrote: post #188

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Blame the perpetrators.

Interesting. Perpetrators suggests a crime. Separately, it suggests that you believe there is a known cause and a source of the malady. - If true, who, do you believe, the perpetrators are ( be as specific as you think you can be )? - If true, what do you believe the crime of those perpetrators is ( again, be as specific as you can )? - If true, who or what is, in your mind, ultimately responsible for the issue that…

> who, do you believe, the perpetrators are

Masked, no ID, claim they are from ICE. Thugs.

> the crime of those perpetrators is ( again, be as specific as you can )?

Assault an kidnapping.

> who or what is, in your mind, ultimately responsible for the issue that has embroiled both victims and perpetrators?

Interesting question: Probably capitalists who want cheap labour and are willing to cut corners to get it

Re: Social Cooling (2017)

#235

Post by A4ET8a8uTh0_v2 » Mon, Oct 06, 2025, 5:16 AM UTC

mindslight wrote: post #215

A4ET8a8uTh0_v2 wrote: post #191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interesting. Perpetrators suggests a crime. Separately, it suggests that you believe there is a known cause and a source of the malady. - If true, who, do you believe, the perpetrators are ( be as specific as you think you can be )? - If true, what do you believe the crime of those perpetrators is ( again, be as specific as you can )? - If true, who or what is, in your mind, ultimately responsible for the issue that…

In another comment, you said " You want to cry me a river over militarization of police and following the basic rules of engagement, I am all ears ". I don't know if that was just a ploy to appear reasonable, but if you really care about that as you purport to then you already know the answers to those questions. As a libertarian, I've had enough with people feigning condemnation for government/police overreach/unacc…

Friend, whether I know or not is not relevant to this discussion. If you were following my conversation with parent then you know the questions were for his benefit, not mine.

That is fair. What would you propose to do about this?

Re: Social Cooling (2017)

#236

Post by A4ET8a8uTh0_v2 » Mon, Oct 06, 2025, 5:23 AM UTC

foobarian wrote: post #214

A4ET8a8uTh0_v2 wrote: post #191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interesting. Perpetrators suggests a crime. Separately, it suggests that you believe there is a known cause and a source of the malady. - If true, who, do you believe, the perpetrators are ( be as specific as you think you can be )? - If true, what do you believe the crime of those perpetrators is ( again, be as specific as you can )? - If true, who or what is, in your mind, ultimately responsible for the issue that…

Bet you wouldn't be this high and mighty had ICE invaded your town and pulled every resident including your family out of their bed at 3am at gunpoint because "they had credible evidence there was an illegal in one of the houses"

Eh, um, I would personally invite you to the discussion at gp level, where I dismiss this line of argumentation outright. It doesn't do much for me. Honestly, it does not advance your argument either. What I would or would not do is rather irrelevant in a grand scheme of things. However, in aggregate, it would be rather problematic. And it does not appear to be happening at that scale.

Do you know why?

Re: Social Cooling (2017)

#237

Post by A4ET8a8uTh0_v2 » Mon, Oct 06, 2025, 5:25 AM UTC

tptacek wrote: post #190

A4ET8a8uTh0_v2 wrote: post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Friend. You want to cry me a river over militarization of police and following the basic rules of engagement, I am all ears. In the meantime, detained is not arrested. Based on your overall posture, I must assume that you know this. Hell, cop can detain you during a traffic stop if they so choose. How is it any different for a building full of people? You are upset, but it is not entirely clear to me why. In a sense,…

These were not simple detentions; this was ICE taking every door in a 5 story apartment complex at 3:00AM, and detaining every single resident for over 4 hours. Nothing at all like the types of detention Justice Kavanaugh refers to when he talks about the minor inconvenience of a police stop-and-investigate detention. It is not the case that your local police can do this in response to a traffic infraction.

This is, by far, the only rational argument put forth so far, but even here I feel obligated to nitpick. What exactly is 'simple detention'? Are they separated in terms of severity or is it just one giant class of detention that is subject to an opinion of the officers on the ground? One would think that a massive crackdown like this would be at least 4h of one's life.

Re: Social Cooling (2017)

#238

Post by 0xDEAFBEAD » Mon, Oct 06, 2025, 5:26 AM UTC

ivape wrote: post #127

0xDEAFBEAD wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This sort of vague, association-based reasoning can be used to prove anything. The US is a country with over 200 years of history, currently with hundreds of millions of citizens. You can cherry-pick whatever "visuals" from whatever "inflection points" you want, in order to prove whatever conclusion you want. For example, here is a thread on /r/AmerExit, a subreddit you would expect to have an anti-American bias, on…

I'm also rather skeptical of "Great Nation" or "Great Culture" theories of history. Quoting Hateful Eight: ”So, I’m supposed to freeze to death ’cause you find it hard to believe?” - Chris Mannix I can’t do anything about your skepticism. There’s about 7-10 things I casually left out, no cherry picking in sight. You can’t figure out that Lincoln was a great man, then what else is there to say? We’re taking decades of…

>There’s about 7-10 things I casually left out, no cherry picking in sight.

If there's no cherry picking, you should also be able to name the 7-10 things I casually left out of my post =)

Re: Social Cooling (2017)

#239

Post by A4ET8a8uTh0_v2 » Mon, Oct 06, 2025, 5:33 AM UTC

mindslight wrote: post #219

zaphar wrote: post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I read the link you posted. As far as I can see there was in fact reasonable suspicion that there would be people in those locations who were not supposed to be there. I can both realize that it is traumatizing for those involved and also recognize that the situation exists because there are people who coming in who are not following the process for doing so and Chicago has positioned themselves as the place to look…

Man, you people will really turn off your basic empathy and reasoning on the flimsiest of excuses. That could just as easily be your family getting attacked at 3AM. And if you dare to exercise your 2nd amendment rights to defend yourselves against a night time home invasion, perhaps even being summarily executed. I assume until this actually happens to you or at least someone in your community, you will just keep on…

Friend. The truth is some people should not be in US. And now, after years of kicking a can down the road, we are in a painful process of rectifying this oversight. It is being confronted. I think your concern is that is not being confronted in the manner you find desirable.

That is fine, but at least be honest about it. Don't hide behind 'I am suddenly concerned about people breaking into my house at 3am'.

Re: Social Cooling (2017)

#240

Post by A4ET8a8uTh0_v2 » Mon, Oct 06, 2025, 5:35 AM UTC

ehaliewicz2 wrote: post #227

A4ET8a8uTh0_v2 wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You may want to elaborate. Note that the emotional tone or non-plausible scenarios are not the way to advance your argument here. Still, I will counter to show some good faith. My mom would not have placed herself in a position where there is a gun in her face.

Damn, so you can just choose to not have guns pointed in your face? Regardless of where you live? Everyone who has had a gun pointed in their face must have been really stupid then.

You can. The people in that story could too. All they had to do is not be there. They were there illegally. It took effort and multiple decisions to get them there. So yes friend. It genuinely is a choice.