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I tried Servo

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Re: I tried Servo

#231

Post by criticalfault »

airstrike wrote: post #81
echelon wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Questions for the Rust UX experts: Is Dioxus (or Leptos) much more performant than Tauri/Electron? I want to (1) build blindingly fast, low-latency, super performant UX for users, which precludes Tauri/Electron (something I'm currently using and unhappy about), but I also want to (2) maintain developer velocity, (3) have access to nice UX primitives and widgets, and (4) have it look nice and modern. Javascript/browse…

I'm super biased in favor of iced. Yes, there are missing features (it's not even version 1.0 yet!) but I think the number is very small now and the solution is usually to fill in the gaps yourself—which is possible because iced is totally modular I've made a spreadsheet editor and a slideshow editor with it so "slimmed down photoshop" seems feasible although admittedly you will likely need to get deep into the rende…

Is it possible to force iced to use vulkan exclusively?

Re: I tried Servo

#232

Post by criticalfault »

daniel_sim wrote: post #86
echelon wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Questions for the Rust UX experts: Is Dioxus (or Leptos) much more performant than Tauri/Electron? I want to (1) build blindingly fast, low-latency, super performant UX for users, which precludes Tauri/Electron (something I'm currently using and unhappy about), but I also want to (2) maintain developer velocity, (3) have access to nice UX primitives and widgets, and (4) have it look nice and modern. Javascript/browse…

Check out https://www.gpui.rs/ too

Does it use Vulkan exclusively?

Re: I tried Servo

#235

Post by Ygg2 »

echelon wrote: post #155
spease wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Slint recently added Bevy support. I’ve been keeping an eye on it since I’ve used Qt and love working in Qml.

Slint cites Javascript. Is it another Electron/Tauri-like?

What?! No. It's Rust GUI toolkit. I swear people see JS support and think Electron.

Re: I tried Servo

#236

Post by Certhas »

lesuorac wrote: post #211
Certhas wrote: post #182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not sure that's a realistic assessment of the cost of developing a browser. Mozilla gives Software Development exp names as by far the single largest expense at 260M$ in 2023. According to DuckAI 700 out of 750 Mozilla Co employees work on Firefox. I am sympathetic to the idea that a global remote team, that doesn't pay Silicon Valley salaries could get this done cheaper, and thus would be a better candidate for such…

> so 402/653 is spent on the core activities you favour I don't think that's correct. IIUC, Software Dev was 260M for Mozilla + Mozilla Corporation + Mozilla Foundation + MZLA Technologies Corp. + Mozilla Ventures + Mozilla.ai. With large increase of 40M from 2023 to 2022 so I'd bet a good chunk of that is going to Mozilla.ai knowing how the rest of the corporate world is acting right now. Like the Chrome Mobile team…

So one of several teams working on Chrome Mobile (so not the rendering engine, JavaScript engine, etc...) was 40+ people. That tells us nothing about the size of the overall Chrome team.

I have seen comments on HackerNews that estimated 1000-4000 people working on Chrome at Google, but without a sound basis. Chromium had ~800 individuals author a commit, that's probably as close as we can get to actual hard facts.

The Platform Division which includes Chrome was 20.000+ but it's pure guesswork to break out numbers for Chrome for that.

Honestly my prior is that the vast majority of software dev work at Moz goes towards Firefox, I don't see any evidence to the contrary, including in terms of products released/developed. A modern browser is an enormously complex engineering feat, nothing else Moz releases is in that ballpark.

I guess bottom line is that we don't really know the exact breakdown.

Re: I tried Servo

#237

Post by gaazoh »

YmiYugy wrote: post #23
ObscureScience wrote: post #3

While it's hard to know what comes of it, there is also https://ladybird.org/ to challenge to monopoly of Blink.

I just don't get the point of ladybird. They have full time engineers and are soliciting donations, so it's clearly more than a hobby project. Maybe my assumptions are off, but I just can't imagine they could ever become competitive in terms of features, security and performance with the big engines. Blink is setting the pace, Webkit is barely able to keep up and Gecko is slowly falling behind. All of these teams are…

If anything, Ladybird is an independent implementation of the web standards, and the devs have identified and helped solving quite a few bugs and and ambiguities in the standards, which benefits everyone, from browser devs including the big guns to web developpers and users.

Re: I tried Servo

#238

Post by goku12 »

wodenokoto wrote: post #227
goku12 wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> (Taffy [0]) that can be used standalone and is widely used accross the Rust UI ecosystem, including in the Blitz [1] web engine (which also uses Taffy for Flexbox and Block layout) This is the first time I hear about Blitz. Looks equally interesting and ambitious. It is probably the real undercover web engine. Servo was widely known around when Rust debuted.

Wasn’t rust and servo co-developed?

Yes. That's what I meant, in case my framing is confusing.

Re: I tried Servo

#239

Post by airstrike »

criticalfault wrote: post #231
airstrike wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm super biased in favor of iced. Yes, there are missing features (it's not even version 1.0 yet!) but I think the number is very small now and the solution is usually to fill in the gaps yourself—which is possible because iced is totally modular I've made a spreadsheet editor and a slideshow editor with it so "slimmed down photoshop" seems feasible although admittedly you will likely need to get deep into the rende…

Is it possible to force iced to use vulkan exclusively?

Yes, if you write a custom vulkan Renderer and use it instead of the provided wgpu one

iced is generic over the Renderer type

Re: I tried Servo

#240

Post by kookamamie »

lvass wrote: post #149
specproc wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wow, just did this myself. The difference between Firefox and Chromium was depressing. I'm getting >100 FPS almost consistently all the way up to 1,000 in Chromium, FF barely made it above 500 before dropping below 60. Probably not a completely fair test, I've no extensions etc. on Chromium and only use it for the odd stubborn website, but that was quite a lesson in their comparative performance.

For me it was stable 120fps on firefox at 2200 and 60fps at 3200, using 200W in my RX 6750XT. Chromium hit below 60fps at around 4000 and below 30fps at 6000 but used my integrated intel GPU all the time.

Hehe, I threw my 9950x3D+RTX5090 combo at it.
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