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DOGE worker’s code supports NLRB whistleblower

krebsonsecurity.com

231–240 of 586 posts

Re: DOGE worker’s code supports NLRB whistleblower

#231
post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

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> "Tenant-admin" isn't such a radical thing Admin accounts without logs is extremely radical. I have literally never seen it, or had anyone request it, in my decade+ of consulting in security. Unless you think the whistleblower, Krebs, and everyone else reporting are lying. Which, in that case, nothing anyone says is going to change your opinion (and you should just say that, if it's what you think, to save us all ti…

[flagged]

Re: DOGE worker’s code supports NLRB whistleblower

#232
post #198

The CEO of Tesla and Space-X; a self-proclaimed high IQ individual, an alleged programmer, has apparently hired a straight-up script kiddie to their elite delta force of technical government downsizers.

I agree with the script kiddies comment- which is basically what the reporting has shown... but in a way isn't that part of the point? That they can save billions of dollars just by having a couple of relatively normal comp sci kids (who can't even rent a car) review the most basic financial information of our government departments. These guys aren't supposed to be "delta force" they are supposed to be the interns.…

Your comment assumes the conclusion that these comp sci kids were able to save billions while preserving the correct behavior of the system, i.e. if their changes cause even one person to miss one payment they should have received, then the rest of your comment is entirely baseless.

If you could prove that billions were saved in pure waste, then I’d imagine any sane citizen would agree with you, setting aside matters of decorum and human decency (e.g. RIFs that may ultimately be necessary but conducted in an inhumane way)

I’d like my tax money used efficiently, but this group does not merit the trust to carry out those changes, even on a technical level

Re: DOGE worker’s code supports NLRB whistleblower

#233
post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> all-powerful “tenant admin” accounts that were to be exempted from network logging activity Is this normal to build this sort of functionality into a software system? Especially software systems that heavily rely on auditability?

Sometimes, depending on the situation. My company retains all e-mails for at least 5 years, for audit purposes. But if some troublemaker were to e-mail child porn to an employee, we'd need to remove that from the audit records, because the laws against possessing child porn don't have an exception for corporate audit records. So there's essentially always some account with the power to erase things from the audit rec…

It sounds like you haven't actually had to face that situation, because it is more complicated than just having to delete an offending attachment. You would still have an audit log of the deletion of that email record by the superuser, even if the content is deleted. And there would be other records generated to document the deletion, like I'm sure a long email or slack thread from this getting discovered and sent up the chain, over to legal, then to the FBI, then back to coordinating the logistics of manually deleting something from the audit logs. So if for a completely unrelated case, a third party auditor stumbles upon that mess, they will be able to reconstruct why a single attachment cannot be found in the audit logs.

"No" is the answer to GP: there is no legitimate reason for a fully unlogged superuser account.

Re: DOGE worker’s code supports NLRB whistleblower

#236
post #198

The CEO of Tesla and Space-X; a self-proclaimed high IQ individual, an alleged programmer, has apparently hired a straight-up script kiddie to their elite delta force of technical government downsizers.

I agree with the script kiddies comment- which is basically what the reporting has shown... but in a way isn't that part of the point? That they can save billions of dollars just by having a couple of relatively normal comp sci kids (who can't even rent a car) review the most basic financial information of our government departments. These guys aren't supposed to be "delta force" they are supposed to be the interns.…

> Not trying to defend the means to the end, but I would really like my tax money used more efficiently. I will also say am extremely worried about the levels of access that they are being given, especially since it comes with basically no accountability

This is like the derelict father with partial custody who parachutes in one weekend a month to buy his son ice cream and a new video game to leave two days later the conquering hero. Meanwhile mom works two jobs, has to set all the expectations and responsibilities for the child, and the father is late on child support payments.

DOGE blitzkrieged government IT. It'll be years before we understand the scope of what they've done and given available evidence: these are script kiddies who worship Musk, I don't think there is ANY reason for optimism or charitable consideration.

Re: DOGE worker’s code supports NLRB whistleblower

#237
post #75
post #8

> According to a whistleblower complaint filed last week by Daniel J. Berulis, a 38-year-old security architect at the NLRB, officials from DOGE met with NLRB leaders on March 3 and demanded the creation of several all-powerful “tenant admin” accounts that were to be exempted from network logging activity that would otherwise keep a detailed record of all actions taken by those accounts. Feels like a pretty good Occa…

[flagged]

This doesn’t make sense unless they’re doing something illegal. They have backing from the top to audit the system. They don’t have to answer to any of the people who might complain, so the only reason they need to do this is if they’re doing something which violates federal laws where the penalties are worse then getting an angry email from someone in the security group who your boss will yell at for you.

The other big problem with this theory is that there’s no evidence of sabotage. During the first Trump administration, federal employees followed their leadership just like they had for Obama, Bush, etc. and every sign shows that would have happened again, except for the refusal to take on personal liability for breaking federal laws.

Re: DOGE worker’s code supports NLRB whistleblower

#239
post #198

The CEO of Tesla and Space-X; a self-proclaimed high IQ individual, an alleged programmer, has apparently hired a straight-up script kiddie to their elite delta force of technical government downsizers.

I agree with the script kiddies comment- which is basically what the reporting has shown... but in a way isn't that part of the point? That they can save billions of dollars just by having a couple of relatively normal comp sci kids (who can't even rent a car) review the most basic financial information of our government departments. These guys aren't supposed to be "delta force" they are supposed to be the interns.…

> review the most basic financial information of our government departments

That is what the GAO is for https://www.gao.gov/ , and these people are much better than script kiddies.

> I would really like my tax money used more efficiently

Me too! You are on hacker news so I assume you are firm believer in https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amdahl%27s_law ! If you would like your tax money used efficiently, are you willing to discuss cuts to social security, medicare, medicaid, veteran benefits, and whatever else is at the top of the budget? https://www.cbo.gov/publication/61181? What would you cut?

Personally, I would increase taxes on anyone making over $500K/year and stop nickle and diming our federal government so the US can actually become a first world country for everyone that isn't a software engineer.

Re: DOGE worker’s code supports NLRB whistleblower

#240
post #40
post #8

> According to a whistleblower complaint filed last week by Daniel J. Berulis, a 38-year-old security architect at the NLRB, officials from DOGE met with NLRB leaders on March 3 and demanded the creation of several all-powerful “tenant admin” accounts that were to be exempted from network logging activity that would otherwise keep a detailed record of all actions taken by those accounts. Feels like a pretty good Occa…

> all-powerful “tenant admin” accounts that were to be exempted from network logging activity Is this normal to build this sort of functionality into a software system? Especially software systems that heavily rely on auditability?

From a an old hackers perspective disabling shell history can have positive security implications. But in today's 'cattle not pets' systems mentality I'd expect all actions to have a log and not having that seems fishy to me. Keeping logging infra secure has a dubious, the log4j fiasco comes to mind. I'm not a fan of regulation for most things, but I think we need a higher cost for data leaking since security is an afterthought for many orgs. My personal leaning is to be very choosy about who I'll do business/share data with.
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