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Tesla's FSD – A Useless Technology Demo

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Re: Tesla's FSD – A Useless Technology Demo

#231

Post by red75prime »

tsimionescu wrote: post #210
red75prime wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which ones? Waymo is geolocked. Mercedes' Drive Pilot is a glorified lane assist. Cruise is suspended. Who else?

Geolocked driverless cars are a major advance over FSD. Mercedes "glorified lane assist" is actually safe in well defined parameters, and gives you a well defined amount of time (10s?) to re-engage, with guaranteed fail-safe if you don't. FSD is... A tech demo?

> gives you a well defined amount of time (10s?) to re-engage, with guaranteed fail-safe if you don't

I don't see it in "DRIVE PILOT Special Terms and Conditions".

> As the fallback-ready user of this system, it is the responsibility of the user of the DRIVE PILOT Subscription Services to remain receptive and take control of the vehicle as soon as DRIVE PILOT function issues a takeover request.

> Conditions may arise at any time that require the user of the DRIVE PILOT Subscription Services, as the fallback-ready user, to respond to a takeover request.

> If a user of the DRIVE PILOT Subscription Services does not respond to the takeover request within a certain period of time, the vehicle’s emergency stop procedure will begin

I think you understand that in real life the situation can go outside "well defined parameters" at any time, so the wider the acceptable set of parameters the better. And Drive Pilot seems to be pretty limited in that.

Re: Tesla's FSD – A Useless Technology Demo

#232

Post by kemiller »

rjh29 wrote: post #141
drcode wrote: post #131

I have FSD v12 and for my drives, in my part of the country, I have to do a mild safety intervention maybe once a week (like, getting closer to another car than I'm comfortable with) sorry other people are having different experiences, but FSD is a significant quality of life improvement for me. Nothing is nicer than getting in the car after a long day and letting it chauffeur me home. (yes I still pay attention)

People who drive often find basic driving "automatic"; if you still need to be vigilant, maybe even hypervigilant because you're not personally driving the car, what's the advantage?

You don’t have to be hypervigilant. And in particular you don’t have to pay attention to basic lane keeping, which frees your attention to scanning ahead for potential issues. Not sure if or when it’ll ever be truly autonomous but it’s still a huge value as is. Maybe not $12k like they tried for a while, but significant

Re: Tesla's FSD – A Useless Technology Demo

#233

Post by Too »

TheDong wrote: post #99

The thing I've been most amazed at about FSD is that there hasn't been any sort of lawsuit around FSD refunds. There are people who paid thousands to tens-of-thousands of dollars for a promise that their car would eventually have "full self driving". A not-insignificant portion of those people have lost any chance at actually getting FSD, whether by their car being totaled in an accident, or having sold it, or such,…

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40408455 Tesla must face vehicle owners' lawsuit over self-driving claims. 26 days ago.

Re: Tesla's FSD – A Useless Technology Demo

#235

Post by ffsm8 »

kevincox wrote: post #182
tjoff wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Is Nvidia's CEO just saying this because Waymo doesn't buy GPUs from them? Yes.

It's amazing how little you can trust these people even though you would expect that the CEO of NVIDIA has a reputation to maintain.

Did you forget the crypto and nft hype train presentations that Jensen did ~2 years ago?

Re: Tesla's FSD – A Useless Technology Demo

#236

Post by ffsm8 »

krzyk wrote: post #213
debatem1 wrote: post #198

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ambition isn't the goal, self driving is. Who cares how many sensors it has as long as it works?

Well, if something will be prohibitively price it is just like not existing.

TIL that Porsche cars don't exist.

Re: Tesla's FSD – A Useless Technology Demo

#237

Post by [deleted] »

epolanski wrote: post #122
matthewdgreen wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Waymo cars drive themselves without (in person) supervision. As best as I can tell from three rides, they do it perfectly. However the range is limited to city streets in a few cities, no interstates at all (they are adding this soon.) The Tesla FSD even at v12 can go about five minutes before I have to intervene. If you’re extremely tolerant and don’t care what other drivers think (eg weird slow behavior at stop…

#2 doesn't sound too bad if you only need to intervene at times, the number of workers is way smaller than the one of taxis.

[deleted]

Re: Tesla's FSD – A Useless Technology Demo

#238

Post by Workaccount2 »

hankman86 wrote: post #64

They should teach Tesla’s “autopilot” (and its FSD upgrade) in business schools. Turns out you can sustainably push up company valuation on vapourware. You have to wonder if Tesla’s autonomous driving technology was actually ever meant to turn into a product. Or whether it is mostly a tool to justify the lofty Tesla stock price. I very much doubt that it is technologically ahead of its competitors.

Cathy Wood of Ark investments just gave Tesla a $2000 price target on the back of FSD taxi service... That's around a $5T valuation.

You have to wonder if she is dumb, or just knows Tesla investors are totally delusional.

Or perhaps, when you come upon an OG delusional musk worshipper, and call them out, they can point at their money pile and call you the idiot...

Re: Tesla's FSD – A Useless Technology Demo

#239

Post by mrkeen »

spdif899 wrote: post #222
catlikesshrimp wrote: post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is really difficult to read if this is sarcasm or not, and I am not being sarcastic.

Tesla's most recent version of FSD (which is released to a limited number of non-employee testers so far) uses only eye tracking for driver monitoring and does not require the user to touch the steering wheel as long as they are looking forward.

Right, I was confused. "Hands-off" intially sounded like it was trustworthy to drive itself.

But in this case it means the car now trusts you to trust it by not putting your hands on the wheel?

Re: Tesla's FSD – A Useless Technology Demo

#240

Post by matthewdgreen »

bdlowery wrote: post #142
matthewdgreen wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Waymo cars drive themselves without (in person) supervision. As best as I can tell from three rides, they do it perfectly. However the range is limited to city streets in a few cities, no interstates at all (they are adding this soon.) The Tesla FSD even at v12 can go about five minutes before I have to intervene. If you’re extremely tolerant and don’t care what other drivers think (eg weird slow behavior at stop…

> The Waymo cars drive themselves without (in person) supervision. As best as I can tell from three rides, they do it perfectly. I drove in a Tesla with FSD 12.4 3 times and it was perfect. it doesn’t mean anything.

Waymo operates a business that offers hundreds or thousands of rides every day under regulatory supervision, and we have public data about accidents (there have been a few.) My anecdotal observations aren’t a replacement for data, but there is data. For the Tesla I’ve had FSD on my personal car since it became available in beta and have way more than three rides. My observations are sufficient to tell me it’s not reliable enough to run unsupervised, at least as long as I’m liable or in the same city as an unsupervised one.
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