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In Colorado, an ambitious new highway policy is not building them

nytimes.com

231–240 of 783 posts

Re: In Colorado, an ambitious new highway policy is not building them

#231

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Crucially, the road network also operates at a loss

In the first level analysis. Once you realize the sheer amount of commerce and business that is enabled by roads you see that they pay for themselves several times over.

Actually, it has been shown that removing cars increase commerce.

Re: In Colorado, an ambitious new highway policy is not building them

#232
post #197

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Except that having more car traffic induces more pollution, more casualties, and more time spent unproductively (you can do other things on public transit, or get exercise commuting by bike), whereas more book reading has few downsides.

>> you can do other things on public transit, What can I do on public transit that people don't do in a car in traffic?

Read a book? Watch videos on a phone? Play videogames? I've done all of these on the train before. I wouldn't dare do these while driving.

Re: In Colorado, an ambitious new highway policy is not building them

#233
post #206

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t think this analogy is quite correct. Driving on a particular route is not a driver’s objective like reading a particular book is a reader’s objective. The driver’s objective is arriving at a destination. The objective in driving is not a finite resource, but the multiple route options to the objective can be, which differs substantially from a library queue.

Let's consider a library with both a manned librarian and a self checkout, two different queues, same objective. Let's call the self checkout the 'highway' queue and the manned one the 'surface street' queue. Each of which could be expanded to improve throughput (more lanes:more self checkout lanes, more streets:more librarians). Ultimately the problem with anti-car rhetoric is that it seeks to limit access to the ob…

In your example, replacing bulky self-checkout machines (analogous to removing road/surface parking real estate) offers a significant benefit to everyone. More room for what everyone actually wants most: books. The preference for self-checkout machines forces a cost on everyone for the benefit of a few.

Re: In Colorado, an ambitious new highway policy is not building them

#234
post #36
post #15

Sounds like the Bay Area. We don't like cars but we refuse to build comprehensive transit. To build transit that works you cannot value everyone's opinion equally and have to just make it happen. Some of the worst localized pollution I have experienced in my life was while living in the Bay Area with the massive traffic jams.

Here's a nice study: https://newatlas.com/motorcycles-reduce-congestion/21420/ They say 10% of traffic being replaced by motorcycles reduces congestion by 40%. California has pretty good weather so it's probably feasible to commute by motorbike almost every day.

Colorado with 300 sunny days a year is a great place for motorcycles. Most of the year it's warm enough too with somewhat decent clothing and a pair of balls. I'll take the bike any day the road is dry and temps are double digit. But if you really want to increase throughput [FWIW, I don't care that much], just enforce driving on the right lanes when not passing. Then anyone who feels they need to go 15 over the limit can safely do that while at the same time funding the police that the metro is trying so hard to defund. Everyone wins. Bam.

Re: In Colorado, an ambitious new highway policy is not building them

#235
post #68
post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The US is not a democracy. Not even at the state level. For many aspects and holons it is a representative republic.

The U.S. is a democracy, albeit a deficient one rather than a working one [1]. At least is the least deficient one amongst those. [1] https://www.democracymatrix.com/ranking

apparently by 2023 it got upgraded to working:

https://www.democracymatrix.com/online-analysis/matrix#/char...

after further looking it turns out that it was also categorized as working before 2020 and after 2020. the difference being 0.01 points. in 2020 it took a dive in rules settlement and implementation for which there is an obvious culprit: covid.

https://www.democracymatrix.com/online-analysis/country#/Uni...

Re: In Colorado, an ambitious new highway policy is not building them

#236

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the first level analysis. Once you realize the sheer amount of commerce and business that is enabled by roads you see that they pay for themselves several times over.

Actually, it has been shown that removing cars increase commerce.

This is a universal outcome with research to back it up?

Re: In Colorado, an ambitious new highway policy is not building them

#237
post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Try a motorcycle! The laws for lane splitting are the best in the country. You could probably fit 6 motorcycles in the space of one car.

Motorcyles have a roughly 30 times higher fatality rate per mile driven compared to cars

So what's the problem? Solves the problem, right? (Yes, I drive motorcycles)

Re: In Colorado, an ambitious new highway policy is not building them

#238

As someone who loves trains and buses and planes, I wish that people who pushed public transport would actually engage with the reasons why people don't want to use it rather than just making alternatives worse. There are three main issues that need to be solved for even me, a train lover, to prioritise using them. 1) Undesirables need to be removed. I don't want to deal with beggars or other general hoodlums. Transp…

Aren't your "indesirables" waiting at the traffic light as well in your part of the world?

Re: In Colorado, an ambitious new highway policy is not building them

#239
post #15

Sounds like the Bay Area. We don't like cars but we refuse to build comprehensive transit. To build transit that works you cannot value everyone's opinion equally and have to just make it happen. Some of the worst localized pollution I have experienced in my life was while living in the Bay Area with the massive traffic jams.

There’s another huge way to put a dent it and let people live where they want: work from home works. The pandemic proved it. It’s not a 100% solution but there is seldom a 100% solution that doesn’t involve totalitarian government since not everyone wants to live in the city in concrete towers.

Re: In Colorado, an ambitious new highway policy is not building them

#240

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What I'm saying is that public transport is a reflection of the local society. You can accept it, work to improve it, or hide from it in your private vehicle. Here in London, hardly a quaint and sleepy village, everyone uses public transport, including beggars and hoodlums as you put it, and it's fine.

We simply disagree that public transport (or society in general) has to accept everyone regardless of how badly they behave. It has nothing to do with "sectors of society". If you want me on the bus, kick off the dickheads. Making driving worse will not get me on the bus however much you attempt to manipulate me emotionally.

I'd also drive more if roads weren't full of "dickheads" and impaired drivers. You have exactly the same kind of issues while driving.

I don't understand your double standard, you should apply the same rules for driving and public transits.

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